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#1071 Re: Guns N' Roses » GNR Evo members' Chinese Democracy reviews thread » 904 weeks ago

I’ve been wrestling with myself for days. How should I review an album that not only have I been waiting half of my life for, but an album whose songs(most of them, anyway)  I have heard in  various stages of completion. Should I take what I’ve heard already and the astronomical amount of time and money spent on recording it into account, or should I just listen to the finished product and judge it on it’s own merits. It’s not that easy to do. Ultimately, it wouldn’t be fair to myself to deny my prior knowledge of the songs. ‘Democracy  isn’t just about the music for me. It’s the journey that makes it’s release so special to me. Overall, I am very pleased with Chinese Democracy. I like it…But, like most music that spends a healthy amount of time on constant rotation in the Jetta, I start to pick it apart. The only albums that seem to be immune to this process are the timeless ones.

Chinese Democracy is not one of those albums.

It could have been.
It should have been.

If this record had come out in 2002 (when it was done), it would be right up there with the classics. The triumphant return of one W. Axl Rose and his “New Gn’R”:
A Gn’R that was a monster. A melting pot of all the great things in music. Not just rock.

A Gn’R that was chock full of borderline genius, virtuoso musicians who had a chemistry together and wrote and recorded most of the material on Chinese Democracy together. ‘Democracy, based on the music from it I had heard up until that point was a monster. A reflection of the band that created it, and the maniacal, tortured, genius of it’s lead singer.   

After ‘02, when it became increasingly clear that the record was not going to be released anytime soon, (for reasons that  still remain unclear)  these musicians began to leave.
Instead of unleashing this monstrosity of a band (and album) on a salivating public, Mr. Rose was instead finding replacements for them.
These replacements were then replacing performances on an already completed album. And that, in my opinion, is the lone reason Chinese Democracy ‘s status changes from a “classic” album, to a “pretty good” one.
By the time the public legally hears it, this masterpiece has been littered with copy and paste performances that sounded like what they were:
Out of context, unnecessary  and vastly inferior to what the previous musicians had recorded years ago.

What we are now left with are great songs that were taken one step too far.
Make no mistake, this is no indictment of Ron “Bumblefoot” Thal and Frank Ferrer. They are gifted musicians who were put in an unenviable position.
Had they been given ample time to become fully acclimated to the material or been left off Chinese Democracy altogether, their brilliance reserved for creating new material, This review would have a much different tone.

1. Chinese Democracy has a stunningly epic intro. Exactly what I would’ve expected, and more… probably the only time on the entire album I would say that Ron Thal and Frank Ferrer added something that made one of these songs better.  I  like the change in the drums.. The double tap snare beat isn’t used until the solo. It gives the song some breathing room. A looseness that it desperately needed. It has that Old School G n’ R anthemic swagger and venom. A great song

2.Shackler’s Revenge smacks you upside the head. Right out of the chute. I’ve read a ton of reviews where it’s been said that this song seems out of place on the album. I disagree. It has a relationship to the title track not unlike the one It’s So Easy had with Welcome To The Jungle… An adrenaline shot. It’s insanely catchy “disco on steroids and acid” vibe and Axl’s brilliant multi-tracked  vocal performance works for me on a level I can’t quite pinpoint. Thal’s solo is sick. Although, I’m left wondering what it replaced.

3. Better has been one of my favorite songs for the last couple of years. There is a flow to it that is extremely comfortable, and an emotional vocal melody that compels me to sing along. Robin Finck’s outtro guitar solo is the closest I’ve heard anyone come to sounding like Slash, ever. It has the best shot at being “the hit” on this record and maybe that’s why it wasn’t left alone. The additional guitar and drum tracks on this song were initially really pissing me off. They were obviously added over the top after it was mixed. They sound so completely out of place, it was really hard to enjoy the song. The more I listen to it, the less it bothers me, but still.. Was there something urgent that compelled Axl and Caram Constanzo to plug in  Ferrer’s drum fills after the fact?

4. The Blues… If you call this song “Street Of Dreams”… You just don’t understand.  Another of my favorites that’s gone through some changes, but nothing dramatic. It used to have more of a “Ziggy Stardust” kind of vibe, now it’s straight up Guns N’ Elton. That’s not a bad thing. The vocal performance surprised me. I never thought Axl’d be able to hit some of those notes again after hearing him strain through Sweet Child O’ Mine in 1992. The lyrics, while sappy, are incredible. “What I thought was beautiful, don’t live inside of you anymore”… Gets me every time. Great musicianship throughout.

5.If The World was the first test of faith for me. The first time I heard it, it was filler. Now, I kinda love it. I hear noise about “Blaxploitation films” and “James Bond”…
No.
It’s Axl soaring over Angel Dust era Faith No More. With a dash of killer Buckethead acoustic guitar work. Definitely a grower.

6. There Was A Time is to me, this album’s Estranged. A sprawling, heavy duty epic with no real chorus. Excellent arrangement, killer guitar work and perfectly blended mix make this song a keeper, even if you, like me, got kinda tired of it back in 2004.

7. Catcher In The Rye. Maybe it’s my fault. Maybe I shouldn’t have listened to the 1999 demo of this track with Brian May from Queen. If I hadn’t, I would be describing this song as “O.K.”… great vocal melody with too many guitars doing too many things out of sync for the first 2 minutes. Far and away the most overproduced song I’ve heard by anyone in a long time….. But I have. And I’m absolutely fucking bullshit. This was the best song written in the last 20+ years, and the removal of May’s stellar, subtle guitar work on the whole song (not just the solo, kids) killed it. Not to mention the plethora of brilliant, haunting multi-tracked vocals, and the backbone of the song(the piano)that have been buried beneath the cluttered mess. Next…

8. Scraped starts with a “chorus of Axl’s” that would have been more palatable to some if it wasn’t a cappela. I think it serves as a nice transition from the gentle Catcher, to this straight forward hard rocker. This song is nothing to write home about, but it does have one of the better vocal performances from Axl on the album. He’s singing like he did on Appetite on this track. And that is no small feat.  It’s an uplifting “Fuck You” song that after the second or third time I  heard it, I found myself  humming it at work. Even if the song as a whole seems a little generic.

9. Riad N’ The Bedouins could have been left on the cutting room floor. The reason people are saying this song could hang on Appetite For Destruction is the very Rocket Queenish rhythm vibe during the verses and, of course the high pitched Axl wailing. The intro is very cool. And I really like the vocal melody of the “All my salvation” part, but it’s a B-side at best. And Ron’s pasted on solo is a slap in Buckethead’s face.

10. Sorry is flawless.  Proof that this band can do anything. And do it well.  A Pink Floyd On HGH monster. Lyrically, Axl’s response to old band mates(Slash?) ripping him in the press and the fans who believe it.
11. I.R.S. has some elements added that have given it a teensie bit more muscle than previous versions had. But it’s more or less the same song. Illusion era Guns N’ Roses with a modern sensibility… a shit ton of stuff going on in this song and a great vocal performance. The T.W.A.T. review sums up how I feel about this song.

12. Madagascar is proof of why the record should have come out in ‘02. During the surprise performance on the VMA’s,  This song blew me away. Now, I’m pretty much burnt out on it. It’s a good, epic, Axl song. Next…

13. This I Love… So this is It, huh? The mythical This I Love? I gotta say, at first I was a tad taken aback at how cheesy this song is on the surface. But once I took the time to pay attention to how sincerely heartbroken Axl sounds on this track, it’s tough to be so cynical. The guitar solo gets a bad rap. Sure, Slash (or Buckethead) probably could’ve blown Robin’s solo out of the water,  But they don’t. And Robin does a good job of transferring the vocal emotion to his guitar.. Well done, sir. Easily the second best track on the album, next to…

14. Prostitute. A stunning closer. If this song is a snapshot of the things to come… Sign me up. Great drumming(please come back, Brain) and a vibe that is at the same time mellow and heavy. The outro is immense…I don’t even know what to say.. I’m a blithering idiot. This song rules.


Overall: 7 out of 10
This album would have easily been an 8 or a 9 if some of the best material on it hadn’t been mercilessly butchered after Andy Wallace mixed it to perfection.

Production issues aside, this is a strong album that will never live up to the expectations that were created by fans and critics alike. Axl should be proud of Chinese Democracy. It leaves the past behind and blows the doors open to endless possibilities. The real lesson to be learned here is:
If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.

#1072 Re: Guns N' Roses » New York yawns at Chinese Democracy » 904 weeks ago

FlashFlood wrote:

where I bought mine in Manchester, NH there was a big display right as you entered, impossible to miss. The vinyls were proudly displayed at the top.

sounds to me like the manager of that particular best buy dropped the ball.


BEFORE ANYBODY SAYS ANYTHING

that doesnt mean that Axl and co. didnt drop the ball either, marketing wise.

Same thing in Concord, NH....

#1073 Re: Guns N' Roses » Lyric discrepancies in the CD booklet » 904 weeks ago

i'm not sure if it's been mentioned previously, but in the recording credits, they refer to "Sorry" as "Sorry for You".....

#1074 Re: Guns N' Roses » Surprise appearance at the AMA's? » 904 weeks ago

Neemo wrote:
Smoking Guns wrote:

I watched that whole fucking thing!  Fuck me.  What a waste.  It was Alicia Keys with Queen Latifa and some other Soul singer.  What a fucking joke.  There were like 9 piano driven songs tonight.  So this I love would have fit right in.  The Piano is so dramatic, if axl plays piano in a song have you ever noticed everyone says right then its his greatest song ever?

you shoulda read bigbri's post on page one 16

bigbri wrote:

Not gonna happen.

well then Fuck Me for starting this shit ass thread....

#1075 Re: Guns N' Roses » Surprise appearance at the AMA's? » 904 weeks ago

that was the worst "special finale" i've ever seen.. ever.. anywhere...
fuck.. the warden likes all the shit on that show tonight.. and even SHE was like.. "what the fuck?"

#1077 Re: Guns N' Roses » Surprise appearance at the AMA's? » 904 weeks ago

tejastech08 wrote:

shitty crap

16:laugh::haha::laugh::haha::laugh:

#1078 Re: The Garden » zeitgeist » 904 weeks ago

both great films.... they 'bout some up everything i believe

#1079 Re: Guns N' Roses » Surprise appearance at the AMA's? » 904 weeks ago

Neemo wrote:
jorge76 wrote:
tejastech08 wrote:

Billy Ray and Miley Cyrus = pathetic.

What does it mean when so far her song was the most rock and roll thing on the show?

And I'm including Coldplay.

I'm with tejastech08 Coldplay sucks a dick...I havea hard time figuring out who is more boring between them and Radiohead

i just recently got plugged into the radiohead thing... they're pretty good.... very mellow at times.. but good..
coldplay is the epitome of bland, anonymous, pussy-whipped nonsense....
they literally make me ill..
at least radiohead is interesting... they mix it up a little...

#1080 Re: Guns N' Roses » CD first impressions » 904 weeks ago

i found that the burned leaks.. well... i had to crank em up to 9 or 10 in the car... the cd only at 5 or 6 for it to blow me outta the seat...

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