When two persons from opposite sides of the rabbit hole communicates, there are bound to be misunderstandings

I'm no expert in Irish history, but as a history buff I am well aware of the long standing conflict. On the other hand I do have extensive knowledge of government subversion and rebellions, past and present. So when I see the same old government agents fingerprint another domestic rebellion I'm bound to make certain conclusions. Am I certain? No, but I am confident. To the point of my life.

And my focus on the more clandestine aspects of this issue does not mean I don't appreciate the full context, it just means that is what I'm interested in. You can offer a different opinion if you want. Your current reply is more indictive than it is constructive.

If everybody is aware of the criminals in your government, why don't you do something about it? Like in my country I don't think you really know how crooked they really are. It's not part of the process, it's criminal and deliberate.

johndivney wrote:

while it is true the provo's (provisional IRA, not the 'real' or 'official IRA' who were a much smaller band of terrorists) were infiltrated by british agents it's incorrect to say that was the reason the IRA began to lose support with the people.
the horrendous acts of violence, particularly upon civilians, in the publics mind far outweighed any kinda of nationalist 'cause'. yea there were spike in public support for the Provo's - internment & the hunger strikes but the majority always believed in peace & democracy.

firstly, the majority of nationalists (who are mainly comprised of Catholics) were never supportive of the IRA.
that however is not to dismiss the support they had. they simply wouldn't have been able to function & survive without people hiding them or funding them.

the main factors in the IRA's eventual cessation & giving up of their weapons were: a war-weariness of the people & the recognition the violence had reached a stalemate - that the British were not going to leave the 6 counties through war. there were other factors, but the British had been secretly talking with the Provo's from the 70's (i think, possibly the 80's - my memory is fuzzy on this)

however, most important in undermining the nationalist cause for re-unification is of course financial. it makes more sense for nationalists (& catholics) to be part of the union of GB than it does to rejoin the 26 in a free state.
during the 90's the british government was pumping 6/7 BILLION per year into NI - which was substantially more than any other region of the UK. & i'm p sure the budget compared to other UK regions is still wildly out of proportion.

things are a LOT different now than even ten years ago., nevermind in the 20's - 80's..
in this era of fairness (& even the use of affirmative action - such as the aim of having a disproportionate number of catholics in the police force...) the idea of freedom & a cause seem a lot less important. Ireland will only be reunited when it makes financial sense for all involved.

& i wouldn't say it was ever a military dictatorship. yea there was rampant discrimination & human rights abuses, gerrymandering & exclusion of catholics/nationalists from government. but those in power weren't military people, they were simply unionists & loyalists who hated catholics & nationalists.

While we don't know all the details and never will, I think you misunderstand the role of BI. They are not there just to bust people. They usually make sure the group they are in in fact does carry out their actions and more than once. Meaning they were themselves responsible for the escalation in violence. In what degree is hard to say, but if I had to put money on it I'd go for the over. They are professionals after all. That is what they do. Subversion, destruction, infiltration.

I'm not sure the government even considered it a real conflict. I suspect, as have been done so many times in the past, they fostered it so they could bring in anti freedom legislation and distract the population from other issues. We know the CIA carried out such operations in Europe (Gladio and Stay Behind), with support from my Government. Without knowing for sure I'd say Britain's no less cynical. If they can chemically experiment on the public for 40 years from the sky, why not. The peace broker was an agent, was he not?

Now that all that's in place, of course the money's flowing in. Now they gotta build their "success". Looks like Colony 101 to me.

About the military dictatorship, if things were worse in the 70s and this is now, I gotta wonder...

The military has been asked to prepare to man Britain's borders during the mass walkout by public sector workers, according to Sky sources.

Up to 18,000 immigration officials are expected to be among those joining the industrial action on November 30 over public sector pensions.

The military have been told to ready themselves to step in if necessary and civil servants have also been approached to help out.

Take your pension, send in the army if you complain?

I'm sorry, but it's high time you get to know the absolute criminals in your government. I can't do much more, I got my own problems at home with a fresh inside job.