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#61 Re: Guns N' Roses » LEAKS THREAD » 409 weeks ago
the thing that is missing the most from CD the song is teh wah wah wah thing BH did at the HOB show
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-P9qTtiH8uA
at the 1:20 mark and again near the end 2:12
That's not Buckethead. It's a synth. Not sure if Dizzy or Pitman.
Someone had a comment about tape being out of date when these were first leaked - not exactly.
The most convenient form of recording sound and taking it somewhere else was still a cassette tape. Unless you had a MiniDisc recorder (remember those?). Ain't nobody had a MP3 player with a line in encoder, and if you did, it sounded like @#$%. Cars still had cassette decks (and CDs!) - and you were happy yours did, because you could connect your iPod with a tape adapter, and that sounded way better than the FM tuner your friend with JUST the CD player had to have.
The first leaks all - whatever the source, strip club CD, record label CD, band insider CDR - were put to some tape and then put back on a computer later. There's too much hiss and analog distortion on IRS 99, Twat 99, CITR, and (IRS?). OR maybe they were put into an analog out and then into an analog in on a MiniDisc. That's the best case. This latest file was definitely digital all the way to us. A good hi-fi system back in the day always had a CD player and a couple of tape decks. Remember that. That would have still been contemporary during the ol' leaks.
Back in 1999 there were lots of CDRs with both audio (wav/dat) and mp3 files. Of course, if you wanted to record with a mic, the most common way was still an analog tape (I had one when I was in college by that time to record interviews), but to rip other CDs there were already plenty of options using a PC with both mp3 or just copying the CD to a CDR. Sure, a line in recording probably would be either a MiniDisc, but the cassette tape wasn't that common either.
I agree with you, the 99 demos had too much hiss and analog distortion, hence why I always felt it was recorded on tape. But someone said the 99 demos were recorded from a DAT tape, and Im not sure how someone would rip audio from that back then.
#62 Re: Guns N' Roses » How many of the 2001 tracks are out there » 409 weeks ago
The Blues
Madagascar
There Was A TimeFrom '99-
IRS
There Was A Time
Catcher In The Rye (Brian May)
Prostitute (uncirculated)
Atlas Shrugged (uncirculated) [Brian May]
Any details about Prostitute and Atlas from that era?
#63 Re: Guns N' Roses » LEAKS THREAD » 409 weeks ago
Id just take anything unreleased. Like I said, it's interesting to overanalyse everything about those recordings IMHO. Not sure why is this something bad now. It's better than deal with shit on my work.
speaking about 2002, uploaded some 2002 tour stuff to mygnr, maybe some people here would by interested as well... https://www.dropbox.com/sh/7jt6qhjlleam … p5HVa?dl=0
Thanks man. I still have everything on an external HD, but this is much easier.
#64 Re: Guns N' Roses » LEAKS THREAD » 409 weeks ago
Voodoochild wrote:Also, there is the quality of the rips: I never understood why IRS, TWAT, Catcher and Checkmate all sounded like it was ripped from an analog cassete player.
Good point and Occam's razor says they were. For instance, Axl went to Vegas in 2003 and some songs got ripped because he obliged his disc to the venue PA. They could've recorded the songs on tape as they were playing. It's a smooth way to do it, just keep a game face with Axl.
By 1999, that was already an ancient technology. The 2003 demos Axl played at the club got leaked in 2006 with at least mp3 quality (low res 128 kb). The 1999 leaks came from a different source. My bet is on someone at Interscope when the near finished album was presented to execs. It was obviously lacking a proper mixing and mastering, but it was enough for them to see what they had.
dalethirsty wrote:for a perfectionist, he sure seemed to ignore his own work a majority of the time.
It has a lot to do with feeling. Axl felt the '99 vocals were untouchable. Recording them was likely a task for him. There'd been a long pause in writing lyrics and singing altogether. The last original song he'd developed had been TIL in '93.
There is a left over vocal in Scraped that sounds like a hiccup. And Bumblefoot's ending solo in Catcher has a dry cut. Feels like even Axl got tired of working endlessly on it and overlooked a lot of fuckups. So yeah, not really a perfectionist.
But I do think he thought the vocals were not the problem and just left almost untouched in all those 1999 tracks.
yup, the Boston promo seemed to have absolutely great mixing.
Indeed. And it translates more or less how it should sound judging by the live performances in comparison.
I wonder how that Boston promo was put together. Maybe Axl/Interscope send just the snippets to the marketing guys to work on. Its interesting tho how it had The Blues ending solo (presumably by Fortus), because that was clearly added between the European leg and the NA Tour. I also like how Robin's guitar riff in CD sounds in studio - although I still like the final version more.
#65 Re: Guns N' Roses » LEAKS THREAD » 409 weeks ago
Wagszilla wrote:Roy Thomas Baker gets a lot of shit around here but his work is the only time the project reached a professional level of quality. If you compare any of these early leaks to Oh My God, they seem rough, patchwork, and amateurish. The Piazza leaks were certainly what you'd come to expect.
OMG was mixed and mastered on Beavan's watch. He was certainly a capable enough producer to sew things up. And RTB was likely equally marooned before Tom Zutaut came aboard in 2001.
I don't think we should compare demos to official released tracks (I don't care what Axl said, it was officially released and went through mix and mastering). Every demo is a work in progress, and we don't know for sure what was the status - there's some stuff that could be placeholder for a new overdub, we just didn't get it. Also, there is the quality of the rips: I never understood why IRS, TWAT, Catcher and Checkmate all sounded like it was ripped from an analog cassete player.
I don't really hear anything groundbreaking here
Less orchestration...a bit more guitars
There's no orchestration and less guitars, actually.
#66 Re: Guns N' Roses » LEAKS THREAD » 409 weeks ago
I'll repost what I said on MyGNR:
IMO, this is not fake. It COULD be fake, but it would be really hard to put it together like this. There's some indication that its real - the scratching guitar at the very ending last a bit longer than on the CD version (which had a fade out). The other thing is the drums sounding more like Josh Freese. Bucket's solo starts different and there's some different Tommy bass there. Also, Axl's background vocals wouldnt be that easy to remix from the Rock Band tracks since they are mixed together.
Could the guy fake it through some really painful rework on the available tracks? Yeah. He also would have to rerecord some keyboards, drums, bass and guitars on his own. Its way too much effort just to fool a bunch of fans.
#67 Re: Guns N' Roses » LEAKS THREAD » 409 weeks ago
Plot thickens.
Voodoochild wrote:Still. There could be some demos with Josh and Buckethead. This could also be just a reference mix before they replaced Brain's rerecorded drums.
The infamous 'three good songs' album from mid-2000 featured Josh on drums. Some of Robin's stuff likely remained, but Brian May and Bucket were included. I think that after Bob Ezrin deemed the album needed fixing, they started re-doing the drums.
Didnt know that. Not doubting you, but is there a source? Didnt see a quote from Bob Ezrin on CHinese Whispers.
#68 Re: Guns N' Roses » LEAKS THREAD » 409 weeks ago
I think brain was first then BH but it was right around the same time. It was within the same few weeks. I remember a RS article I think it was, that said Finck out and Brain and BH in.
Still. There could be some demos with Josh and Buckethead. This could also be just a reference mix before they replaced Brain's rerecorded drums.
#69 Re: Guns N' Roses » LEAKS THREAD » 409 weeks ago
The TWAT and IRS 99 leaks are from before BH joined the band.
There are cuts of these songs without Robin. But the question is does anyone have them.
It all depends on that version of the song it is, there is like 15 versions of each song. Both Fortus and Dizzy confirmed this.
I know. I meant that even the 2005 very first IRS leak still had Robin. In fact, Robin was in every single studio studio recording (excluding the remixes, of course) we had so far - even Going Down. This Madagascar demo would be the first one without him.
Yes, this sounds like it's from the transitional period between Beavan/Robin and RTB/Bucket in early 2000. As you said, the drums sound more Josh than Brain.
Hard to say for sure, but this is definitely the oldest version of Maddy so far.
Glad to see that I'm not the only one who thought the drums sounded more like Josh. I'm not 100% sure, but still.. didn't Brain joined the band a bit after Bucket?
The album cuts are bloated and poorly mixed (that's right, Axl & Caram). Part of the problem was obviously that there were too many options accumulated over the years and they ended up compiling everything from sub-bass to superfluous overdubs, because more is more.
I met Caram once. Asked how many layers of guitars were in Scraped. He laughed and said he couldn't possibly remember.
#70 Re: Guns N' Roses » LEAKS THREAD » 409 weeks ago
I like the mixing more than the album version but the guitars are lacking in this version, if someone like evader can add in robins and BHs missing guitar parts, I think it would be way better.
If the album version was mixed like this version it would be way better.
The thing that makes me not like this version is the mess of a rhythem guitar player.
And I agree with you, this could be a cut from what Robin was not in the band, because when Robin left the band BH redid all his parts and Robin was removed
that mess of a guitar is paul or axl
It may be just Axl's idea of what he would like in that particular section. The final version indeed has a somewhat similar guitar lead, although much better played, of course.
might be one of those versions that had Robin deleted - after he left the band in 1999, with some later touches by RTB in 2000/2001, regardless of that Robin got back by that time.
Yep. But it's different from what we got previously. We had IRS (both in 1999 and 2000-ish) that still had tons of Robin's leads. Catcher 99 still had Robin's leads mixed with May's solos. TWAT too still had Robin. It's not like he was erased, he was still there - much like Bucket was still very much present in almost all of the final album.
