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#801 Re: Guns N' Roses » 20 Years Ago: The Snake and the Devil » 601 weeks ago
A very illuminating article from Kerrang, Jan '95 - right around the Zakk Wylde sessions.
Guns N' Roses guitarist, Slash, can't stand new band mate Paul Huge - and that's official! The bombshell was dropped this week by the superstar six-stringer, who says he has never liked GN'R's new axeman - an old friend of band frontman Axl Rose. In addition, Slash sensationally reveals that Axl refused to record with the rest of the band when they entered the studio to work on latest single "Sympathy For The Devil"! He also owns up to the fact that there are no new songs for the long-awaited follow up to the 1991 "Use Your Illusion" LPs.
Life in GN'R is as turbulent as ever. Virtually all new material Slash has written in the past 18 months will end up on his forthcoming solo LP, "It's Five O' Clock Somewhere", due out next month through Geffen. The only other new tune written by the guitarist features on a high-tech GN'R pinball machine called "Snakepit"! "Other than that, "Use Your Illusion" is the last piece of original material, and that's three years ago," Slash shrugs, speaking to Mayhem (a Kerrang! Column) in a no-holds-barred interview. And the guitarist has plenty to say!
It was hoped that "Sympathy...", a cover of the Rolling Stones classic which features on the soundtrack to movie blockbuster "Interview With the Vampire", would be the prelude to a long-overdue burst of GN'R musical activity. But things couldn't, Slash reveals, be much further from the truth. When GN'R got off the road early last year, Slash went straight into his home studio to start work on what was supposed to be a new get-it-out-quick-and-get-back-on-the-road LP.
Things went sour when Axl turned down flat all the songs that Slash had written and put down on tape with GN'R drummer Matt Sorum. Rather than throw these songs away - songs which Axl now wants back for the next GN'R LP! - Slash put together his sideline band Snakepit, and made the aforementioned "It's Five O' Clock Somewhere". Produced by Guns producer Mike Clink and featuring sacked GN'R guitarist Gilby Clarke, Matt Sorum, ex-Jellyfish axe Eric Dover on vocals and Alice In Chains bassist Mike Inez, the Snakepit project could well be seen as an alternative, slimmed-down Guns N' Roses.
Why isn't Duff Mckagan playing on the album?
"It would be Guns without Axl if Duff were playing on it."
A good idea, by all accounts.
"No." Says Slash. "That's not cool.
"Axl is in such a funny place, you know, because Axl is Axl, and no one will ever really understand him as much as he would probably like to be understood. So he really is on his own in that respect. But I've known him long enough where there's a certain amount of leeway with his outbursts that I can handle. They just don't affect me. But I feel sorry for him sometimes, if only because he's such a tough act to be: to maintain any kind of dignity with this public scrutiny and having all this negative press and so on..."
But here you are, his closest friend in the band, putting together your own group - with songs that he now considers Guns songs! Plus, you're with a drummer who's in Guns N' Roses and a guitar player Axl kicked out of the band! He must think you've turned against him as well!
"The Gilby thing did piss Axl off. But Gilby was pissed off too. He was shocked when he was fired, because there was no other reason behind it other than Axl had made up his mind. And of course I had to be the f***king messenger of bad news, which was f**ked for me because Gilby and I are really close.
You don't play with people like that. I hooked up with Gilby and rightly so, because Gilby didn't deserve that kind of treatment - especially when he covered our ass so we could complete the world tour when Izzy quit. I wasn't mad at Gilby. I can do what the f**k I want. And if he wanted to work with me after all this shit...
We (Slash and Axl) just had a really rare, heated conversation a couple of days ago, where everything that I've had brewing - you know how quiet and laidback I am - I just let everything out. He sort of listened to me. I said everything I could possibly say that I didn't agree with. So that's about it."
Has Slash going off on his own like this shocked Axl into taking more notice of him?
"I have no idea. He hasn't heard my record yet. I don't really want to hear his opinion. He and I are so close that he could say something that could dampen my enthusiasm for what I'm doing."
Slash is not thinking too much about Guns N' Roses at the moment. Snakepit is taking up all his time - he's rehearsing and organising a tour - and all of his musical energy. Snakepit is very much in a simpler, more direct, early Guns vein and a lot of the material is very reminiscent of Guns' classic debut LP "Appetite For Destruction".
Slash says that Guns N' Roses' "Las Vegas" (
) direction towards the end of their last gargantuan tour, with the horns, orchestras and backing singers onstage, was something he did not agree with. He says it made him "uncomfortable". The guitarist tried to change things, but failed.
With Snakepit, he's doing everything on his own terms. But GN'R do have a future. Slash says he loves the band "with a passion", that it is where his "heart lies" and - for what it's worth - that he and Axl are as close as ever.
All this in spite of Axl threatening to sue Slash over those Snakepit songs...
Slash says: "Legally, it's all verbal stuff. We have never gone into litigation of any kind with this. Axl just thought that the songs were rightfully Guns' because they were written with the intention of them being Guns songs. I disagree."
Since Gilby was sacked - after speaking out last summer in Kerrang! - the only flicker of activity from the collective Guns camp has been the "Interview..." track, on which Paul Huge (pronounced "hoogie") made his debut. Slash is far from happy with the situation.
"I never liked that guy from day one," he spits. "That's one of the biggest, most personal things that Axl and I have gone through. It really pissed me off that he brought in an outside guitar player without ever telling me. There is a funny story to "Sympathy...".
When the movie came out (in the US) a couple of months ago, Geffen called and said, "Could you do us a favor?" That movie coming out was a big issue for me, because the books ("The Vampire trilogy" by Anne Rice) were great. They have a real kind of passion in there - a sort of dark romanticism - and I'm a real heavy-duty, old time vampire horror movie freak. And it was like Tom Cruise AND Brad Pitt? No f**king way!
So I got this call saying would we do "Sympathy For The Devil" for the movie. I thought, "Well okay, maybe it'll be a vehicle to get the band back together and get the wheels in motion for some pre-production stuff." So I went to the screening in one of those stiff theatres full of showbiz f**king suits, and I'm half asleep! I'm not having a good time, and I couldn't just get up and leave, so I was trying to be cool.
I started smoking some cigarettes, which is not something you're meant to do in an LA cinema... it's like murder! So I got up and left before the lights went out. I have to say Tom Cruise did the best he could, but the film's laughable to me. The Stone's version of the song was playing in the same place ours was meant to be. Anyway, I got up and went home.
I called Doug (Goldstein) and said, "Leave it: the Stone's version's fine. There's no need to do a song that doesn't need to be redone." Then Axl went to see the film the next day, and it's inevitable that he likes it and comes out of the movie completely at odds with me! It just goes with the territory - I love this singer/lead guitarist relationship in bands... it's just f**king stupid! So Axl went and saw it and said he loved it. He was ecstatic. "Let's do the song!" he says. So I said "okay".
We show up at the studio... who shows up? Matt, Duff and I. That was it. Paul Huge came in with Axl a couple of days later. While we were doing it (recording the song), we had to write down how many bars each section was, because without vocals you don't know where the next change is going to come. But we got it done and the guitar solos on and everything, and then Axl went in to do vocals... and the next thing you know, there's this "answer" guitar going on during my guitar solo! It's Paul Huge!
I will probably never forgive Axl for that. But we talked about it. We made a deal that if Paul ever plays on anything, then I should at least be told first, because it really took me off guard. I wasn't there when he did it. Axl likes the song. I haven't listened to it since it was mixed. It's not like it was lousy guitar playing or anything; I think it's how it went down. If people like it, then fine. I haven't gone to see the movie again again because I don't think I could bear it."
Slash says he's got "no idea" when the next GN'R album will appear, but is convinced that there will be one. He and Axl - who is currently checking out bands for the soon-to-be-revived Uzi Suicide label - have come to an agreement whereby any time off Slash gets from Snakepit will be spent working and rehearsing with Guns. The most dangerous band in the world has survived all the obstacles, including three band member changes, and Slash insists that GN'R have gained strength from all of this. Strength to overcome whatever else gets thrown in their path.
The Snakepit tour is set to last through the summer, so don't expect any Guns studio action until then at the earliest. "When I get done with the tour and all that," Slash says, "then we'll see where Guns' collective heads are at. And if everything's okay, then I'd love to continue doing it."
Did you pick up the upheaval Slash inferred to? It was a recurring thing. This is from April 13th, '95.
Before his concert with his own group, Slash's Snakepit, in Manhattan last week, the guitarist Slash took time to discuss the status of the other band he plays in, Guns 'n' Roses, which hasn't released a record since 1991's two "Use Your Illusion" albums.
"There's a lot of confusion as to what this is about," Slash said in reference to Snakepit. "Did I quit Guns? No. Why am I doing this? Because I felt like it."
Snakepit's album, "It's 5 O'Clock Somewhere" (Geffen), was recorded with the Guns 'n' Roses drummer, Matt Sorum. But Mr. Sorum was not able to tour with Snakepit because Axl Rose, Guns 'n' Roses' moody lead singer, decided to start working on new Guns 'n' Roses songs. "If Matt was touring with me, it would stop Guns 'n' Roses in its tracks," Slash said.
Referring to the rhythm guitarist Zakk Wylde, Guns 'n' Roses' temporary replacement for Gilby Clarke, who left the band, he added, "I don't know whether he's going to be part of the band or not. Axl really wants to do a Guns record now. But there's a lot of debate over who's going to play guitar. Axl and I were having an argument about it yesterday."
The preceding day, Aprli 12th, Snakepit played a show in Philadelphia. The most sound conclusion is that Slash and Axl had their discussion over the phone. The below interview was recorded in late May, early June.
Slash takes his time to consider when he last spoke to Axl. His response ("about six months ago") gets a bit of an incredulous response from the interviewer ("Is that so?"). About two months ago would've been more likely, all things considered. I recall another interview from that era where Slash was asked does he call Axl often. Slash immediately dodged the bullet by saying he barely has the time to call his wife.
There was definitely traffic between Slash and Axl throughout that period, but Slash doesn't bring it up much.
#802 Guns N' Roses » Since I Don't Have You - on Madagascar » 601 weeks ago
- apex-twin
- Replies: 3
The tune is a '59 hit from the Skyliners, but I prefer the version Peter Weller (ROBOCOP) performed in The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the Eight Dimension. The film is just as breathtaking as the title lets in, btw.
I wonder if Axl ever saw the film and caught up with the song from that. Could be, it was right down his alley in 1984.
Getting back to the video, it's an interesting piece in a puzzle, really. It's overwhelmingly overlooked for a start. Sure, it's not a great one. But it's more narrative than the random compilations like The Garden; it's actually a step down on the line from Estranged as far the overarching story arc of Guns is coming together in Axl's mind.
The single was out in late May '94, according to a Gilby interview. The Interwebs date the release to 1993, so SIDHY (yes, that's the abbreviation) actually opens a window to the band as it was in the Sympathy era.
K!: The single 'Since I Don't Have You' is out next week...
G: "It's a terrible song."K!: Don't hold back! How do you really feel about it?
G: "I don't like it. When we did the Punk album (`The Spaghetti Incident?'), we'd record stuff on days off. We did 'Since I Don't Have You' in Boston in one day! I didn't think it was gonna be on the record."I dug cutting the T-Rex song - that was cool. But I thought we were making a Punk Rock cover album. And then it turned into being not a Punk Rock cover album! But, it's not my choice. When people ask me about the song, I just say, 'Look, I don't like it'."
There's an apparently highly coked-up Gary Oldman as the Devil. He's driving an Axl wearing an ill-advised cowboy hat. The Devil's curious about everything but the wheel. He bails off. Axl makes for the wheel, as if the Devil not driving was a bad thing.
The car is later found on the shore. The band's there, Duff's having the mandatory drink and some sun, while Matt's playing in the water. Gilby has been given the short shrift, he gets kitchen duty. Dizzy is either fishing ineptly, or trying to save Axl by constantly throwing the net into the sea. It's never suggested that the others are overtly concerned over the events; Matt even breaks the fourth wall by greeting the audience.
Axl is tied up, as we see him. Slash, the other main principle, is absent from the beach party. He's playing guitar in Satan's boat, while the Ol' Iniquity rows him up what seems like Styx. While most band members (aside the hapless Dizzy) are indifferent to Axl's plight, Slash is literally playing Devil's advocate.
Forgive them that teared down my soul...
Are those French horns?
Axl's being roasted. He's all tied up. The beach party continues. Dizzy's either frustrated by the lack of fish or increasingly concerned of Axl. Hard to say. The rest give as much a damn as they always do.
"It's really strange, because the band is like two separate things. There's the guys, everybody except for Axl, and then there's the band with Axl. When we're on the road, we're always together. We hang out together, just like a band. But that's not including Axl.
And then there's the band with Axl. He just kinda comes in and does what he does, puts the vocals on and all that kind of stuff. So when we're in the studio, it's cool. But, you know, I'd been playing with the band for two years before we recorded stuff."
A noteworthy part is that Axl (and Slash) could've technically worked on separate days from the rest of the band. For Duff, Matt and Dizzy it was a one-day gig, Slash came out to do his bits with Gary Oldman. Axl did a scene with Oldman, but aside his turmoil shots, he's mainly seen making out with Jennifer Driver.
We get to see Axl in the car again.
'Don't buy a car with your friends,' he says with his eyes straight ahead. 'Nobody could get the wheel. Everybody had the wheel. And when you have a bunch of guys, I'm telling you, you are driving the car off the cliff.
The car does go off the cliff.
But there's only Axl there.
Axl's submerging. He seems really into doing underwater shots in videos. This is Estranged, sans the dolphins.
He cuts loose and breaks a smile.
"all the chains, we have together"
Axl was tricked by the Devil to run the car off the cliff, Slash played a helping hand there. Duff, Matt and Gilby were into the rock n' roll life, they could care less about the car or Axl. The car are Guns, and the only one doing his bit next to it is Dizzy, motivated by reasons he appears to struggle to comprehend.
What the video does allude to is that Axl felt alienated from everyone and a complete separation from the band was what he was after. As he turns upwards, there is relief, as the Guns are off his back and he is no longer bound by them. The storm hadn't brought him down, yet.
But he was certainly drifting all alone like Madagascar when it separated from India.
When you’ve robbed a man of everything he’s no longer in your power — he’s free again.
#803 Re: Guns N' Roses » 20 Years Ago: The Snake and the Devil » 601 weeks ago
Yeah, it does seem to tie in with what Marc Canter (among others) has alluded to. Slash is the one who brought the Snakepit conundrum to the public and made Axl look like the bad guy. Now, Axl may well have been wrong by thinking that Slash 'stole' the demos from Guns by recording and releasing them under the Snakepit banner, but Slash could've certainly handled the situation differently. Apparently, he never gave Axl a headsup, like 'If there's anything here you want to earmark for Guns, do it quick - I want to release this stuff'.
While Slash was on tour, Axl had to deal with the media reports about the band's dirty laundry, both Sympathy and Snakepit. While Slash's version of the events appears factual all the way, he consistently downplayed his own errors of judgment in the matter. Obviously, the atmosphere in the band and their working relationship suffered immense blows by both their inability to suss out their issues before the Snakepit tour and by Slash's constant comments in the media about how Axl nearly sued him. If Slash really thought he could just come back after that and find a happy Axl eager to work on a new album, he was way off his rocker.
#804 Re: Guns N' Roses » 20 Years Ago: The Snake and the Devil » 602 weeks ago
Some Slash comments from the era. Funny how he uses the same allegory on the 3-4 Snakepit demos almost in verbatim in separate interviews.
"And then Axl went on to do the vocals [for Sympathy] and he brought another guitar player. It was a guy from Indiana, who I can't stand. And he, sort of, added a little rhythm guitar there, but he also put little answers on my guitar solo, my first one. There's two solos in the song. The first one, if you listen to it, you'll hear my guitar and you'll hear this teeny little thing in the background, and that pissed me off. As a result, we ended up doing another cover song that didn't need to be covered, for a lame movie, and it didn't do anything to the band, so it was an effort made, but an effort that was wasted, too."
"When I first got into this [Snakepit] thing, there were certain songs he wanted back. Like he thought that anything went into this hand from this hand with a guitar in between, was to be designated Guns N' Roses material, you know, Guns territory, which wasn't the case." (Slash, 95)
"They [were] intended to be Guns N' Roses songs. Well, you see, that was a problem with Axl I had. Axl figured that once I put this hand together with this hand, that anything I wrote was designated Guns N' Roses material. He was just amazed that I could take off like that, cause I'm always there. With Guns, it's just like, I'm always there. And this sort of shocked him." (The Word, 17/02/95)
"[Axl suing for the Snakepit songs] was mentioned at one point, because, like I said, he's got this distorted vision, or thought, that when I apply my talents to the guitar, or whatever you want to call it, that it's automatically Guns N' Roses material, which isn't the case. That means Lenny Kravitz stuff, Iggy Pop, Michael Jackson, Carol King, would all be Guns N' Roses material. That's not the case at all."
"Stephanie Seymour? I don't even know Stephanie Seymour... Well, she was Axl's girlfriend at the time [while doing the UYI videos]. I don't really like her or dislike her, she's useless. I don't care about her."
(Slash, 02/95)
"Guns is fine, I learned from other people's mistakes not to get so egotistical or selfinvolved, that you quit the band because you can't get along with one of the other guys in the band... I'll be the lead guitar player [on the next Guns album], yeah. Unless I'm fired (laughs)." (Slash, 95)
"We go through these periods, where I do my thing and he [Axl] does his, and then, eventually, we come together and that's when another Guns N' Roses record gets done. When this tour ends, it's a six-month tour, in August, I'll go home and basically, we'll regroup, so to speak. And then, Guns will probably spend a little bit of time in the studio, and then we'll be on the road for a while. We'll be like family for a long time, and when the tour ends, I'm probably just go back do another Snakepit record and do another small club tour. And we'll just sort of play it that way. But of course, nothing is ever that predictable. That's the basic plan." (Slash, 06/05/95)
#805 Guns N' Roses » The Shadow Company: Axl's Ghost Musicians '94-96 » 604 weeks ago
- apex-twin
- Replies: 6
The Axl Rose Band was supposed to be an all-star lineup, a supergroup in any sense of the word. Dave Navarro would play lead, Trent Reznor would man synths / computers, Dave Grohl would be in the drums. With Axl on top, the sound would've been an interesting mix of eclectic styles - if it would work, it would gel into something that was not there before; a unique sound, totally on the pulse of the music nation. That is, as far as the music magazines would be concerned.
The funny thing is, this band happened. Only with a different host of people.
The details are ambiguous as to when exactly this Shadow Company* took place. An easy way to start their gradual inauguration would be in October '94, during the Sympathy for the Devil recording sessions. Axl brought in his old mate from Indiana, Paul. There's been some confusion, as the guitarist known as Paul Huge has also been referred to as Paul Tobias. Tobias is his mothers maidenname. Why the switch? Maybe, the desire to stay low-key despite working for Guns - or being the butt-end of one size joke too many. It's pronounced 'hoo-gie', anyway.
For some background, we need to go back into the halcyon days of the UYIs. Brace yourselves, this may get hairy.
* With apologies to Shane Black.
Vicki James Wright had his start in the UK band Tokyo Blade, in an age almost as tender as Tommy was when he joined The Replacements. Wright quit after their debut album and moved to LA. It was 1987, he went to the Troubadour to see his first show. Guns N' Roses were playing. Wright liked what he saw and decided to stick around. In the space of a few years, he was enlisted into the new heavy metal band Johnny Crash. They released a debut album, which included a minor MTV hit. Within the scope of this expedition, their next album's more interesting, tho.
Johnny Crash Mk II: Vicki James Wright, vox. Chris Stewart, gtr. JJ Bolt, gtr. Andy Rogers, bass. Matt Sorum, drums. Dizzy Reed, keys.
In 1991, Johnny Crash soldiered through lineup changes; in the midst of recording, they found themselves short of a drummer. As luck would have it, the instrumentals for the UYIs had been completed for a while and Matt Sorum was mainly hanging around, waiting for Axl to wrap up the production so they could hit the road. For a long time.
As for Matt Sorum playing on the album, all I can say is that it was a pleasure playing with such an amazing drummer... I know him and [Johnny Crash guitarist] Chris Stewart are old friends. His playing on the second album was probably the best recorded stuff he's ever done. Ask him, I think he'll agree... And as for Dizzy, he did some great keyboards on [the second album].
You may have never heard of Matt or Dizzy featuring on Unfinished Business, the second Johnny Crash album. Even in the studio, bad luck was ongoing. Founding member and bassist Andy Rogers died of heroin overdose shortly after completing his parts. With the drums recorded, Matt returned to Guns. He was substituted by Sid Riggs, who used to be in The Wild with JJ Bolt and Dizzy.
Finally, as insult to injury, Johnny Crash's record label, Epic, shelved the album, despite featuring two current members of the biggest band in the world. Unfinished Business was eventually reacquired and released - in 2008, the CD year. But right now, we're taking the album that was dropped and going for the band that melt down. We're not talking about the Guns, but the Real McCoys.
The Real McCoys: Vicki James Wright, vox. Chris Stewart, gtr. JJ Bolt, gtr. Krys Baratto, bass. Sid Riggs, drums. Dizzy Reed, keys.
The Real McCoys was the band after [Johnny Crash]. JJ Bolt was the guitar player... He formed The Real McCoys with me... [Dizzy] also played with me in the Real McCoys... We did two sets of demos with [producer] Andy Johns, but nothing was ever released. The Real McCoys was similar in musical style to [Unfinished Business], straight ahead sleazy rock with slide guitar and harmonica.
The lineup was rounded by the new bass player, Krys Baratto, and the final Johnny Crash drummer, Sid Riggs. The band were said to have gotten close to a record deal, but this never happened. The Real McCoys broke up, Dizzy left to tour with Guns for a few years, Krys Baratto joined RATT guitarist Robbyn Crosby's band, Secret Service. This band would, again, spend a good two years writing music before folding. It's hard to make a living in music, which is why Baratto must've blinked when Dizzy called in about Guns N' Roses.
The Shadow Company: Paul Huge, gtr. Krys Baratto, bass. Sid Riggs, drums. Dizzy Reed, keys.
Axl had been going on about his solo project since early '94. Somewhere down the line, Trent Reznor had turned into Dizzy Reed. Dave Grohl had become Sid Riggs. For Dave Navarro, there was Paul Huge. Baratto joined in, and the second generation iteration of Johnny Crash would record under the GNR contract.
There are two main ways this lineup could've been originated. The first one is that Axl had it doing the preproduction for his own album while Guns struggled through Snakepit, Gilby, Duff's pancreas and the Devil sessions. The second one is that Axl specifically rounded up the new band around Paul Huge following the Devil sessions and the loss of the Snakepit demos. Another minor clue to the history of the Shadow Company is given by Baratto.
Keep in mind, Sid and I were recording on demos. Paul was involved... We were all a part of putting tracks down on the demos. So, it was never a "version" of the band. It was fun though... Across the mixer were such people as Slash, Zakk, Matt, Duff, Dizzy, and a host of others. (Krys Baratto, Sp1at, 04/15/05)
Zakk Wylde jammed with the band little over a week in January '95. The sessions were more likely a publicity stunt orchestrated by both Guns' and Zakk's manager, Doug Goldstein, than an effort to kickstart the band, but that's another story. This occured three months after the '...Devil' sessions, suggesting Axl had gathered the Shadow Company rather quickly to have them in full swing by that time. So, ultimately, solo album or not, they ended up as employees of Guns.
Baratto would recall that Axl was never there in the studio during his time in the ban.., erm, organization. They had one more than fleeting conversation, during a Halloween party in the Malibu Mansion. Axl complemented the bass lines and asked if the salary was coming in on time. Whether or not Paul and Dizzy were involved in the Axl solo project, Baratto was self-admittedly just doing his job.
Worth noting in this juncture is Slash's "two-week initial period with Guns N' Roses in the late fall of '95", as Axl put it in his MTV fax. Snakepit tour dates help place this fortnight in August; between the final date of the Snakepit tour (07/25/95) and a one-off appearance in Monsters of Rock, Donington UK (08/25/95). Corroborating evidence is the date of the partnership resignation letter by Axl (08/31/95), which, effectively, killed off any progress.
Looking back, this was an important moment in Guns' breakdown, but Axl made good of his word; he really wanted to work on the album. Slash had left town six months earlier, still bummed over how the '...Devil' sessions had gone down.
We had this friend of Axl's, Paul, who really couldn't play that well. He played on 'Sympathy for the Devil.' Fuckin' asshole. I hate that guy. He didn't work out, so I am not really sure where the fuck that shit's headed. I'll deal with it when I get off the road. (Slash, The Michigan Daily, 04/95)
In no time at all, Axl put Paul in a room with Slash. Naturally, the two of them came from very different places. Slash had it in for him, as he saw Paul as Axl's lackey. Duff was there, too. He was probably a bit easier on Paul, given that Slash recalls having an argument with Duff during that time, which broke the camel's back. As it was with Gilby, things boiled to the point of quarrel with Slash, at which point the sessions were off.
That Freestyle session: Shaq, vox. Paul Huge, gtr. Sid Riggs, drums. Dizzy Reed, keys.
The Shadow Company would have its most well-publicized session with NBA basketball player Shaquille O'Neal. Paul, Dizzy and Sid were in rehearsals, business as usual, rolling tape. Shaq was next door, doing a Taco Bell commercial - he'd been making them since July '95. Shaq had words with Dizzy, and played a few chords on the keyboard. Dizzy took over, the rest of them got into the groove. That's when Shaq and his homies began to freestyle. Tape was being rolled and a story took off.
Again, the exact date of this session can be called into question. Through a distance of few years, Spin Magazine dated it at April '97 (reports indicate the Taco Neck advert was completed in the previous month). However, Dizzy later underlined Shaq was still a member of Orlando Magic instead of the LA Lakers, which would place the session to no later than his previous TB advert in February, '96. These are small potatoes in the grand scale, but they become peculiar when considering the political situation surrounding the Shadow Company.
As we look closer, another small mention from the era turns into yet another possible sighting of the Shadow Company. This time, it was by no less than Johnny Rotten/Lydon from the Sex Pistols/Public Image Ltd. fame.
When the Sex Pistols were rehearsing for their 1996 reunion tour [set to begin on 06/21/96 in Finland], Pistols mainman John Lydon claimed to have heard 'some folky nonsense' emanating from the next room, only to discover it was actually Axl and co hard at work. (Kerrang, 08/21/99)
Rehearsal bootlegs indicate the Pistols were rehearsing in LA during May/June. At that point, Axl and Slash were still mulling over their disputes regarding the new partnership deal, which makes it unlikely the main lineup was present. Did Axl and Lydon meet? Doubtful. Axl was never there in Krys Baratto's time, and Lydon could've gotten the information without stepping in Guns' space.
I saw Guns N' Roses listed on the bulletin board in the lobby of the studio so I stuck my head in to check it out. (Shaq, Spin, 07/99)
Hence, a plausible chain of events is that in May/June '96, Lydon heard 'some folky nonsense' from the adjoining rehearsal space and found it was reserved for Guns. He might've been surprised to open the door and find the Shadow Company therein, with Axl nowhere in sight.
Thus, with some confidence, we can assert the Shadow Company was laying the groundwork for Guns from Oct '94/Jan '95 to May/June '96. Slash came back into the fold for a trial period in August '96, and this may have spelled the end of the Shadow Company as it was. They had a bunch of songs, or sketches of songs, in the can. This was Axl's contribution to the '96 album; what he felt would've made a good Guns album if coupled with Slash's guitar parts.
We have been doing mostly Axl's material. (Slash chat, 10/16/96)
We are working on rock songs that last only 4 minutes (laughs). We already did 7 songs and we will write 7 others. (Matt, 09/23/96)
The songs are really good, and I have a good vibe about it. (Slash, Kerrang, 09/21/96)
The strangest thing is how Axl promoted Paul Huge into the lineup not once, but twice. By these later sessions, he was already running the GNR empire from a judicial point of view. Any other way would've kept Paul as Axl's closet musician, as - let's face it - he had a terrible track record on working with Slash. The Sympathy sessions had put Paul in an unfair situation between Axl and Slash, and Paul and Slash never appeared to have a mature conversation on the matter. They were just ushered into a room [possibly meeting in the flesh for the first time in the process] and when it didn't work out, Axl decided that was it - and set in motion the acrimonious partnership split.
By August '96, it was clear Axl felt Paul had a real role to play in writing the next album. As said, Axl having everybody else as an employee was the only way to keep Paul onboard. Axl could've wised up and thought, 'Oh, well. I'll just get someone Slash likes to get the ball rolling.' The way things were going, one has to wonder whether Axl deliberately pushed Slash to act up by repeatedly enlisting Paul, so that another round of disciplinary moves could come to play.
In the end, Axl got what he wanted; most of the early CD songs were a three-way split between him, Dizzy and Paul.
#806 Guns N' Roses » 20 Years Ago: The Snake and the Devil » 605 weeks ago
- apex-twin
- Replies: 28
October '94.
The end of days was at hand for Slash and Axl.
And I went: "Dude, we finished it already. It's gone."
And he goes: "You couldn't have done an album in two weeks."
I said: "Oh yeah. I can."You can do that. And it turned into a big fight."
(Slash, Canadian Radio, 04/20/95)
The fight was over those 3-4 Snakepit demos Slash had recorded with Matt early into the year. He'd intended them for the next Guns album, so he had Gilby redo the rhythm parts. Duff was still touring behind his solo album, Believe in Me, so Mike Inez from Alice in Chains helped out. All was good except for the fact that Axl dragged his feet. Axl didn't see the whole Southern Rock aspect as a predominant part of the next Guns album, which he was envisioning to be... well, a lot of things.
Axl wanted This I Love in there. That song, demoed during the UYI tours, made Slash's skin crawl. Another Stephanie Seymour ballad, he sighed. More progress had been made on the preproduction of Axl's solo album, and since nothing else was coming together, Axl felt it was a stroke of genius to merge the project with the Guns album. Slash was abhorred - now Axl was giving him that Pearl Jam ticket. Things had just gone from bad to worse.
The Snakepit demos had been an earnest effort to get Guns' musical direction back to their gritty club days, towards the magic of Appetite. Following the fortunes of the yesteryears, Slash had enjoyed the luxury of a personal recording studio; the ability to do what he wanted, when he wanted, and most importantly, how he wanted. The demos were his bargaining chip to get away from sobby ballads and Pearl Jam influences, and he wasn't going to let it slide.
Axl scoffed most of the demos, but expressed interest in the chosen few. Slash made his stand; no changes. Guns would do them as is, because Slash felt they represented the purity of the vintage Guns material. Like AFD, or the instrumentals of the UYI tracks. Before Axl put on layers and layers of production. If these songs would indeed make the cut, Slash was ready to fight tooth and nail for his original intentions with them. It wasn't as much the songs as it was about principle: he was fed up with Axl now getting his way with everything, all the time.
There had been the Gilby situation. They had all gone to a room to write as a band. It was tricky, though. There were issues that had gone unresolved for the past few years. The shadows of Izzy and Steven loomed large over them. Duff's health was getting iffy. After some awkward moments, the songs began to trickle. A riff here, another there. Alas, Gilby had to soldier through the look he would get at any given time. 'Where's Izzy?' It all finally caught up with him and he lashed out at Slash. The sessions were over, right there and then.
Gilby had commitments by then. He had a solo album deal with Virgin, outside of the Geffen contract, which contained the recording agreements of founding Guns members. His album was in the can, he had a backing band ready to hit the road for the remainder of the year. He'd played his hand, knowing they might not call him back. They wouldn't. Gilby had lost the backing of Slash, the one founding member who'd championed him thus far. The writing sessions had failed to set the band on fire. Axl had a reason to have it his way.
There had been the Duff situation. After those sessions with Gilby, he'd gone off to Seattle to pass the time, like he'd done so often after coming back from tour. On April Fools Day, he flew alongside Kurt Cobain. Cobain was dead in a week. A month from that, Duff nearly joined him - his pancreas had its well-publicized swell, which changed his life. No more hard drinking with Slash and Matt, but mountain biking and healthy eating with Axl. Duff was now Axl's confidant and right-hand man on musical direction.
Throughout all this, the haggling over those 3-4 demos went on. This was standard practice with Guns. Everybody else recorded their stuff and presented the demos, Axl picked the ones he wanted to sing on. The rest were scrapped, no exceptions. Duff, as well as Izzy with the JuJu Hounds album, had set a precedent: they could record outside the Guns moniker, and get away with it. Slash wanted the songs out in a certain style. He set out to prove Axl and Duff a Southern Rock album would do, and pressed REC.
And it turned into a big fight.
Axl felt had. Those 3-4 demos, which he felt were in the running for the next Guns album, were now gone. Slash had vetoed his contributions without notice. Unsurprisingly, Axl immediately felt like suing Slash for breach of contract or whatever his lawyers could concote. But Slash had written and recorded the demos in his own basement, on his own time. There was no case, as he'd never signed the demos off to Guns in the first place. Slash had changed the rules of the game and Axl was not about to conform quietly.
In less than a year, Axl would make damn sure the Snakepit situation would never be repeated. All the while, he was spending more time with his legal, battling his ex-wives, than with his band, writing the next album. The lawyers would recommend a coup d'etat; leave the Guns partnership, own up the name and have everyone else on the payroll. It was within the existing recording agreement - he could get away with it. And he did, although his legal failed to underline he'd still have to work with those very people.
A more immediate ripple would occur before that, tho. David Geffen, the head of Geffen Records, was involved in producing the big-budget Tom Cruise/Brad Pitt vehicle, Interview with a Vampire. They were a month away from release, and there was some conundrum over the song during the end credits. Given the subject matter, Jay Aston from the goth band Gene Loves Jezebel had been commissioned an entry. It was scrapped in favor of the Stones' Sympathy for the Devil. But that version was an old hat and the financial pressure was there. Someone said, 'Well, Guns are on the label'.
A&R Man Tom Zutaut began grooming Guns to humor the label. Slash, a horror movie buff, went into a screening first. He hated the film and told Zoot they would be better off by going with the Stones cover. Zoot must've had sweaty palms the following night as Axl sat in an otherwise (naturally) vacant theatre. What Axl saw was probably similar to what he'd had going in the Guns videos since Don't Cry, a man doomed to traverse in and out of mortal coil for reasons unbeknownst to him. Slick, long-haired immortals likely struck a chord and Axl said yes.
Slash thought, fine. At least, they'd all get into a room and work on it, together. Only that Axl was sore over the Snakepit demos and was likely plotting their Devil version as an audial precursor for the new album. That's why only Slash, Matt and Duff attended the instrumental sessions. Slash did a revisionist solo for their version, he wanted it to carry the Guns signature. Axl was decidedly avoiding Slash and told through some middle men that the guitar solo needed to be more like Keith Richards. Moreover, note to note Richards.
Slash complied, irked. He wanted to talk to Axl and stormed into the vocal session. Axl shunned him. Slash left, feeling despodent. Axl did his vocals in varying pitches and mixed several takes together into the end result. Then, he did what could be seen as an immediate revenge over the Snakepit demos, and equally unheard of in Guns history: He tampered with Slash's guitar solo.
When the November Rain mix was on the table some years prior, engineers would later recall stories of how Axl would come up to Slash and, very politely, ask for a specific lick to be a bit louder. Axl went out of his way to personally inform Slash of the slightest alteration and Slash would have final say on mixing his own parts, anyway. When Slash put on the final mix of their Devil cover, he would've assumed the old gentlemen's agreement was still intact.
By the time he got to the solo, Slash was irate. There was another guitar, another guitar player. Axl had smuggled in his old Indiana friend Paul Huge to do a louder tune version of the Richards solo, and inserted it underneath Slash's solo. It was an imitation of call and response, a studio trick pulled to fatten up the sound without straying too far from the original Stones version. Axl had been studying this sort of modernization of sound for some time and was curious to see if it would big Slash's guitar up.
Above: Hear the infamous Paul Huge contributions.
And it turned into a big fight.
Slash felt had. While Huge had been merely Axl's underling and playing the good soldier, in Slash's mind, he grew to encompass all that had gone wrong between Slash and Axl during the past year. Had it been different for the band if another guitar player would've done the Devil session with Axl, or if Slash would've put those 3-4 demos aside while recording Snakepit, we'll never know. What's more certain is the band fell apart in slow motion over a period of years, due to the fragile egos of two men who successively shunned one another instead of mulling over their problems.
20 years later, rumors are abound that they may mend fences sometime in the future.
#807 Re: Guns N' Roses » Rock in Rio - Las Vegas 2015 (Any chance?) » 606 weeks ago
A Dust N Bones leg, anyone?
Axl / Tommy / DJ / Fortus / Frank / Dizzy -configuration?
#808 Re: Guns N' Roses » Rock in Rio - Las Vegas 2015 (Any chance?) » 606 weeks ago
DJ's definitely doing the right thing; he's doing the Paul Huge thing. According to Dizzy and others, Paul spent the first years (yes, years) of his part in the CD saga just recording stuff and organizing it. All that stuff was poured into Axl's Pro Tools, and he'd go through it eventually.
“I said, ‘Sharon [his wife and manager], I ain’t fucking 21 anymore. If we’re going to do [it], I want to do it before I’m 70. Time isn’t on our side.’ So she made the call and came back and said, ‘Yeah, the record company wants another album. - on the next Sabbath album
Is it that simple for Axl? Technically, yes. Guns are on UNI contract, the AFDem Bluray sold well (bearing in mind concert blurays are still a soft market) and Axl's been cultivating the casual fanbase by actively touring. Generally behaving himself.
Will the record company promote it to a degree that'd suit Axl's demands is a different story. By the regularity he's touring, he could do his bit by virtually selling it on the road. The more important question, however, is how long Axl needs to lick his wounds for the reception ChiDem got before he can risk the emotional turmoil he's already faced by going through it again.
I think he wants to come back. It's just a question of how long it takes Beta to procure to know-how to tell the right stories between the label and Axl, so that Axl would feel comfortable when solicited for a release.
#809 Dust N' Bones & Cyborg Slunks » Snakepit -era Slash interviews, curious. » 607 weeks ago
- apex-twin
- Replies: 2
I transcribed some of the more curious bits, but the whole things (and then some) can be accessed here.
Slash Slammer!
Murray Engleheart ducks for cover as SLASH tears into Hanoi Rocks and Johnny Thunders, whose songs were recorded for GN'R's hit album 'The Spaghetti Incident?'!
"We did a Hanoi Rocks tune but we decided not to put in on the album because we didn't wanna give Andy McCoy (former Hanoi guitarist) the money! McCoy's an asshole! The basic track was done but we never did any vocals on it. We also recorded a basic track on Iggy's 'Down on the Street', but we didn't finish that either. We stuck with 'Raw Power' - it just sounded cooler.
..."Steve Jones (ex-Sex Pistols axeman) was just like, 'Well, when's it coming out? When's my first cheque due?' So he was happy with it!
..."I didn't even play on the Johnny Thunders song ('You Can't Put Your Arms Around A Memory') cos I hated that little f*cker! So I really wasn't all that concerned when he died. We worked with him a coupla times, and I didn't like him at all. No disrespect for the deceased, but he's not one of my heroes, let's put it that way! I did like the Dolls (Thunders was a guitarist for Sleaze Rock legends the New York Dolls), but I just wasn't very interested in Thunders.
..."We never did talk to Soundgarden about doing 'Big Dumb Sex'. It was one of those spontaneous things. We were in the studio and it just sounded good. Of all the bands we played with during the '...Illusions' tour, Soundgarden were one of the coolest, just personable and down to earth. I was just happy to pay homage to them in the first place, although I did wonder what they might think when they heard it!
Realistically, though, isn't it going to be a long time till Guns N' Roses deliver a new album?
"Not necessarily. The only thing I know at this point is that I'm gonna take the 'Snakepit' thing on the road in March. We'll be touring till summer and then we're off. What happens then I don't know.
"There are some things that need to be sorted out. Axl wants Guns to do a lot of ballads and stuff, and I want to do rock stuff. I don't care about the current musical climate or what is commercially viable. That's why my records sounds that way it does. I'm just a street-level guy, and I don't fucking live one the beach in Malibu. And I'm not gonna conform to any of that shit either."
"We would write these songs in one night. When I first started writing stuff, Matt and I would get together - here's this riff, here's that riff - we'd finally get from point A to B and put it all together and leave it at that. There wasn't a lot of orchestration, like 'November Rain'. There were no vocals on it at this point but the songs were arranged.
...So I put all these songs down, Matt and I would play them - I played bass. Then Gilby got involved and Mike Inez got involved. Gilby redid all the rhythm guitar parts that I'd already recorded and Inez came down and redid the bass parts. That was very fortunate because I'm not a good bass player.
...Anyway, we had finished the entire record with no vocals... One of the first songs Eric [Dover] did was a song called 'Beggars and Hangers-On', where he wrote the whole song in one night. I was really impressed with that... It's about everybody we know! Half the girls I've met in my career to this point... So we went to Rumbo in the Valley and wrote the lyrics and melodies for 13 songs in one day.
I had a couple ideas... I had two songs with lyrics I'd finished myself, 'Be the Ball', and 'Take It Away'... 'What Do You Want to Be' is me and Eric... 'I Hate Everybody But You' is the closest I ever got to a love song, I wrote most of the lyrics for that.
[The instrumental] was a riff I'd been carrying around that Axl hated. He called it "red neck". He hated it so I never did anything with it.
Eric wrote his ideas from listening to the tapes... Once he gets the concept I might change a line here or there... 'Back and Forth Again' was my title but Eric had the lyrics. It's about people not being able to come to some cohesive understanding and breaking up...
'Neither Can I' is something Eric came up with as far as the concept is concerned...'Soma City Ward' [refers to] a drug you take when you're in a psycho ward. That's Eric's... There's one song called 'Lower' that was inspired by [the suicides of] Savannah and Kurt Cobain... 'Dime Store Rock' is Gilby's music and Eric's lyric... 'Monkey Chow' is a Gilby's song, I don't to this day know what it's about.
I have Guns on my mind so I couldn't take forever to put together the quintessential new rock band 'cause that wasn't my point. It was just a release for me... It's within our contracts to do one... There's no rules, you can do it way under budget so it doesn't cost a lot and the only thing I can do is promote it as much as I can so for the amount of effort spent, the money that goes into it, that I do what I can for it.
I have to worry about the pre-production for Guns, and who's gonna play guitar now that Gilby's not in the band... What happened was we were rehearsing and Gilby was really out of it one day. The morale of the band, we were all trying to keep it together and he was the odd man out that day. I was complaining and then Axl called me that same night and said he didn't want to work with Gilby anymore for a lot of different reasons. In a way I sort of went along with it, at least Axl thought I was going along with it because I had my own complaints from that night at rehearsal. This was about a year ago.
...Axl wanted to bring a friend of his that I didn't like. Right now there's a big hole on the second guitar. There's ideas going around, but fortunately I'm doing this other thing which lets me buy time. Axl's got an agenda but it doesn't really match mine. Every day is a new test, one after the other... Axl's out in Malibu. Halloween is the last time I saw him, but we talk. There's no bad blood between us, we just haven't figured out what we want to do and I'm a little concerned about the direction Guns goes in. We were supposed to do some stuff this month but we haven't done anything up till now and in March I'm gone [on tour]. Maybe in February, if we can come to some sort of an agreement as to what we're gonna do.
#810 Re: The Garden » Batman: Arkham Knight » 608 weeks ago
Currently, the release date projected on Rocksteady's official site et al is June 2nd, 2015. No coincidence, they're giving up the Xmas market and aim for the summer holidays.
Tells you something about the faith Warner Bros has on Rocksteady by now. In the industry, it's been a sad norm to push games out unfinished, simply to hit some dubious release schedule and imagined earnings. PC games have sometimes been fortunate enough to win back some of that enjoyability by post-release patchwork, whereas console games have been less fortunate.
Rocksteady's been laying the golden eggs, now twice in a row, which is why they were able to pass on the Bat's 75th anniversary in the ground of delivering a better product with additional devtime. We'll see.
) direction towards the end of their last gargantuan tour, with the horns, orchestras and backing singers onstage, was something he did not agree with. He says it made him "uncomfortable". The guitarist tried to change things, but failed. 