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Re: Chinese Democracy official reviews thread
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/23/arts/ … =1&_r=1&hp
Sorry, already posted.... And I agree, this album is a lot of great things, a great guitar Album it is not. I don't thing GNR is even a guitar band anymore. That isn't a bad thing, unless you liked GNR more for Slash/Izzy than Axl, then you might not like this album that much.
I tend to agree with almost all of that NY Times review.
Re: Chinese Democracy official reviews thread
http://blog.allmusic.com/2008/11/21/gun … democracy/
pretty solid review from ALL Music Guide-Stephen Erlwine....
- A Private Eye
- Rep: 77
Re: Chinese Democracy official reviews thread
Guns N' Roses - 'Chinese Democracy' (Polydor) Released: 24/11/08
It certainly causes a stir...
by Greg Rose
Saturday, November 22, 2008
3/5
With most of the world expecting an overblown ego trip and the rest past caring, countless years and line-up changes later, Guns N' Roses' ‘Chinese Democracy’ finally arrives. Anything other than a complete disaster has to be heralded as a triumph for Axl Rose – and he just about manages it.
The fact that it has been completed at all is quite remarkable considering the amount of legal wrangling and false starts that have hampered the record. But there is little point if it is not worth listening too. Of course, it isn't ‘Appetite For Destruction’. There are unsubtle nods to the band's early behemoth, but the rapid recklessness of their 1987 debut is not relevant decades on. Also, without the original Guns – especially the fluent excesses of Slash's solos - it feels the new players are imitating rather than innovating.
It is difficult to capture the same breakneck speed though when 12 of the 14 songs insist on straining themselves far past the four minute mark. Epic tracks are created not through length and pomp but with purposeful progression. Rather than build from playful or solemn beginnings into staggering finales such as on the likes of ‘Paradise City’ and ‘November Rain’, ‘Better’ and ‘I.R.S’ begin rugged and workmanlike and maintain their pace.
There is variety though, especially in the instrumentation that seeps from the seams of ‘There Was A Time’ and ‘If The World’. Axl's much-documented desire for grandeur amongst the grit of Guns N Roses is partially satisfied, with the songs satiated with pianos, strings and computer effects. These do add an extra dimension compared to the throwaway tosh of ‘Riad N' the Bedouins’, but extinguish any possibilities of spontaneity - it sounds planned within an inch of its life.
‘Scraped’ is almost a Muse song, its warped fret wizardry melding with paranoid intensity, and is strangely exhilarating. The military sobriety of ‘Madagascar’, morphing into sampling of Martin Luther King Jr, is another departure, an attempt at a meaningful moment that comes across over-thought and undercooked. However, despite there being few stand-out moments, ‘Chinese Democracy’ is saved by the very reason it isn't better - it's creator.
Axl's lyrics are as insipid as ever but somehow match the idle anger that festers in his finest flashes. He labours over slow songs, seemingly still aching over Stephanie Seymour and everybody else he has crossed in the mess of his middle years. He screeches his distinctive wail in the harder numbers and rubs his mark over every inch of the record. It's loud and abrasive, then slumps into brooding fits of melodrama. It's ambitious but doesn't seem to be going anywhere. It flirts with brilliance but flits it away in gluttony and overexertion. Above all, it certainly causes a stir, but since when did Guns N' Roses need an album to do that?
Re: Chinese Democracy official reviews thread
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: Chinese Democracy official reviews thread
Brave Words and Bloody Knuckles just put up their first of two reviews. Here it is and I am afraid it is not good:
Yup, it's finally here ... do we care? The jury is still out. Do YOU the reader/listener care? Time will tell and the time is now! Here is the first of two (?) BraveWords.com reviews of GUNS N’ ROSES' Chinese Democracy that FINALLY officially streets tomorrow (Sunday, November 23rd). Check out David Perri's take below:
Even just typing out that infamous record title for the purpose of this review is surreal. I mean, did anyone really think that Chinese Democracy would ever surface, let alone in 2008? It takes only one listen to this 14 year, $13 million purported tour-de-force to realize that W. Axl Rose, whether in a fit of delusion of grandeur or as a result of being seemingly a lonely recluse, has tried to create the greatest rock record of all time. He’s quite clearly not succeeded, but Chinese Democracy reeks of bombastic ambition anyway (and sometimes overbearingly so, as is the case in the opening moments of ‘Madagascar’, ‘There Was A Time’ and ‘Sorry’): it’s clear Rose aims high. But the main fault here, aside from the inexcusable sin of Slash and Duff not being involved, is that Chinese Democracy sounds dated, which is not surprising given that it's been in production since the Clinton administration’s first term. As well, when Chinese Democracy began its life-span, Rose’s obsession was then-superstar Nine Inch Nails and, though I’m a big fan of NIN, referencing Trent Reznor’s technological work in your own is always an immediate death sentence, as trendy technology has trouble standing the test of time. Chinese Democracy is at its best when Rose and his motley crew of hired guns (Tommy Stinson, you deserve so much better) do what Guns was once known for, namely rocking out with reckless abandon. As such, the top moments on Chinese Democracy are ‘Riad N’ The Bedouins’ and ‘Shackler’s Revenge’ (despite that lame intro), with the title track/first single also showing potential, but no hook. Chinese Democracy’s undisputed highlight, however, is the brilliant ‘Better’, a song that is amongst the best of the GN’R canon and should have acted as the archetype for the rest of Chinese Democracy. Elsewhere, Rose references everyone from the aforementioned Nine Inch Nails to Queen (and how), Pink Floyd, reggae, hip-hop and film soundtracks; ergo, Chinese Democracy feels like the inconsistent decade-old effort that it is, a record that is alternately confused, way too AM radio earnest (‘Street Of Dreams’, ‘Catcher In The Rye’) and morbidly fascinating, like that terrible highway wreck you just can’t take your eyes off of. After ten-plus years of not giving a shit about Axl Rose I have become curious enough to actually listen to Chinese Democracy, but that’s where it ends for Axl and his warped opus: the second Chinese Democracy is released, it loses all relevance, mystique and influence. The very fact that Chinese Democracy never surfaced is what made it so notorious and coveted, and now that it’s actually here it no longer possesses its vast cache of significance. In order to keep the cult of Chinese Democracy alive Rose should have never released this, and should have instead continued to offer only vague clues about the record via Sebastian Bach in the upcoming years. God damn, did anyone think W. Axl Rose was actually going to pull this off?
5/10
Re: Chinese Democracy official reviews thread
didn't see this one here, but i saw it on another forum. enjoy.
http://www.torontosun.com/entertainment … 1-sun.html
It's been said that the greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.
And maybe -- just maybe -- the greatest trick Axl Rose ever pulled was convincing the world Chinese Democracy was never coming out.
Think about it: Had Rose slapped together a disc 10 years ago, few would have cared about a Guns N' Roses album with virtually no members of GN'R on it. But by vanishing from the scene, holing up in studio after studio, treating his bandmates like chattel, and control-freakishly tweaking these songs for more than a decade, he told the world he was building something monumental on no one else's terms. And by withholding it for year after year, he turned it into the mythical Holy Grail of rock: The Most Wanted Album in Music History.
Everyone thought he was nuts. Turned out he knew exactly what he was doing. Listening to Chinese Democracy, you can hear -- and appreciate -- how much time went into these songs. Nearly every one of these 14 cuts is a massive epic crammed with umpteen parts, endless twists and turns, and layer upon layer of overdubs: A Great Wall of guitars from Bumblefoot, Buckethead and others, sure, but also electronica beats and loops, horns, strings, choirs, sound effects, you name it. And, amazingly, it all works: Instead of a bloated, indecisive, self-indulgent mess, Rose -- whose corroded, Joplin-esque shriek is still capable of shattering glass -- has created an audacious, over-the-top masterpiece that almost justifies all the years and money and mayhem and hype.
And, to give the devil his due, that's a helluva trick in itself.
Chinese Democracy 4:41
Fade in on a haunting Asian melody, whispering voices and ominous arpeggios -- and cut to a buzzsaw guitar riff, a swaggering beat and snarled lyrics about power and control. After 17 years, what are Axl's first words? "It don't really matter ... All I got is precious time." So there.
Shackler's Revenge 3:35
Axl's fascination with electronica asserts itself here as he fuses squiggly keyboards and modem-shriek stabs with hard-chugging guitars and a serpentine beat. Call in GN'R V 2.0.
Better 5:00
Opening with a sing-songy falsetto vocal, a pulsing melody and a beatbox, this seems to be a ballad -- until it kicks into a surging mid-tempo electro-rocker. Now we know better.
Street of Dreams 4:46
Cue the strings: Now it's time for the big, lushly orchestrated grand-piano power ballad -- aka the disc's November Rain. Axl's throaty warbling takes some getting used to, but it works.
If the World 4:50
Can Axl be funky? Apparently, yes -- judging by the Philly soul strings, hip-hop backbeat and wah-wah chicken-scratch licks on this groovy slow-roller. Extra points for the flamenco guitar.
There Was a Time 6:38
An orchestra and choir merge with a beatbox and shuddering, distorted guitars, while Rose waxes nostalgic over an old flame. We presume the tune's acronym is not an accident.
Catcher in the Rye 5:53
Another piano-driven slow-burner set to a gently funky groove and topped with existential lyrics inspired by Salinger. Honestly, this is the only song here that doesn't quite cut it.
Scraped 3:27
An a cappella intro leads into a punchy rocker a la Welcome to the Jungle -- but topped with intricate duelling vocals about how Axl is "unstoppable." No kidding.
Riad N' the Bedouins 4:10
Bedouins? We have no idea what the hell Rose is on about. But the thundering tom-toms and -- sorry, N' -- hard-driving funk guitars are the real stars of the show anyway.
Sorry 6:12
Axl broods through this lethargically slow waltz, blasting an ex (or perhaps an ex-bandmate?) with lines like: "You talk too much / You say I do / Difference is nobody cares about you." Ouch.
I.R.S. 4:30
Returning to the slinky, slow-grinding rock, Rose enlists the president, a PI, the IRS and the FBI to catch a woman who's cheating on him -- or perhaps her taxes. Still, killer chorus.
Madagascar 5:39
Plummy horns and shivering strings, a grandly sweeping landscape, a mid-song audio collage that samples both Martin Luther King and Cool Hand Luke -- Rose pulls out all the stops here.
This I Love 5:34
One last yearning, richly orchestrated piano ballad for the girls -- and the Queen fans in the crowd. Surprisingly, but wisely, Axl keeps the studio trickery to a minimum.
Prostitute 6:12
And one last bombastic, even more richly orchestrated electro-rocker for the boys. "Why I would choose / To prostitute myself / To live with fortune and shame?" asks Axl. Translation: Don't hold your breath for the sequel.
---
GUNS N' ROSES
Chinese Democracy
Rock
Sun Rating: 5 out of 5
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: Chinese Democracy official reviews thread
Guns N' Roses - 'Chinese Democracy' (Polydor) Released: 24/11/08
It certainly causes a stir...by Greg Rose
Saturday, November 22, 2008'the new players are imitating rather than innovating'
'Rather than build from playful or solemn beginnings into staggering finales such as on the likes of ‘Paradise City’ and ‘November Rain’, ‘Better’ and ‘I.R.S’ begin rugged and workmanlike and maintain their pace.'
'Axl's much-documented desire for grandeur amongst the grit of Guns N Roses is partially satisfied, with the songs satiated with pianos, strings and computer effects. These do add an extra dimension ..., but extinguish any possibilities of spontaneity - it sounds planned within an inch of its life.'
'The military sobriety of ‘Madagascar’, morphing into sampling of Martin Luther King Jr, is another departure, an attempt at a meaningful moment that comes across over-thought and undercooked.'
'He screeches his distinctive wail in the harder numbers and rubs his mark over every inch of the record. It's loud and abrasive, then slumps into brooding fits of melodrama. It's ambitious but doesn't seem to be going anywhere. It flirts with brilliance but flits it away in gluttony and overexertion. Above all, it certainly causes a stir, but since when did Guns N' Roses need an album to do that?
Best review so far.
Re: Chinese Democracy official reviews thread
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/23/arts/ … =1&_r=1&hp
Sorry, already posted.... And I agree, this album is a lot of great things, a great guitar Album it is not. I don't thing GNR is even a guitar band anymore. That isn't a bad thing, unless you liked GNR more for Slash/Izzy than Axl, then you might not like this album that much.
I think the nytimes one is a pretty accurate review. Nice to see someone else noticed the awful mixing during the outro of Catcher In The Rye. The guitars and especially the vocals are way too high, there is some amazing drum work going on but I feel like I'm cocking my ear trying to make it out.
Also is it just me or do those "Na Na Na" things earlier on in the song come in way too loud?
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: Chinese Democracy official reviews thread
Smoking Guns wrote:http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/23/arts/ … =1&_r=1&hp
Sorry, already posted.... And I agree, this album is a lot of great things, a great guitar Album it is not. I don't thing GNR is even a guitar band anymore. That isn't a bad thing, unless you liked GNR more for Slash/Izzy than Axl, then you might not like this album that much.
I think the nytimes one is a pretty accurate review. Nice to see someone else noticed the awful mixing during the outro of Catcher In The Rye. The guitars and especially the vocals are way too high, there is some amazing drum work going on but I feel like I'm cocking my ear trying to make it out.
Also is it just me or do those "Na Na Na" things earlier on in the song come in way too loud?
The "na na na" needs to find the delete button. It annoys me.
