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#1351 Re: Guns N' Roses » Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond) » 511 weeks ago
I'm not saying that the label doesn't bear a lot of the responsibility also, but it's odd to me to dismiss Axl's involvement altogether. Why didn't this happen to metallica? To Ac/Dc? to every other act then if it's just the label?
Maybe because their albums weren't rejected at a critical moment? I'd imagine if Hetfield have moved forward with Metallica on his own, hands in a finished album and they wont play ball, Metallica fans might have been in for a long wait as well.
Perhaps. However it's the role of an A&R guy to help advise whats a crossover hit and when you have a record and when you don't from a commercial standpoint. On a similar front VR rejected the advice from the label that they should "keep writing" for libertad too. These label guys look for what will sell and while it can put you at creative odds with the label, other acts deal with it.
Again though Axl is the one who decided robin was an adequate replacement for Slash (rather than Gilby as Matt had earmarked him out for) and that the band should be recording songs like Scrapped not You Could be Mine.
If the label called him on it - perhaps it was worried that the recording costs were obscene - masonic temples for the drums - redoing drums note for note - most of the band never having hung out with Axl cos he only phones up in the AM - multiple years with no vocal takes done. If I were them I might be worried how Jackie Chan was going to cash that cheque too.
#1352 Re: Guns N' Roses » Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond) » 511 weeks ago
Labels are indeed well known for being pretty evil, and it is common for artists to get 'stuck' where they label won't let them out of their contract but also won't release anything. I think there's more to that with Axl though or he could have been playing new songs live for years. They seem mentally 'stuck' on the CD songs - even redoing them with Ashba after release.
I really think it's both sides of them. Doubtless the label did some fucked stuff, but I also think Axl didn't cope well with the pressure, and that some of the way he handles things makes it a lot worse.
Here's an interesting article written before CD came out:
#1353 Re: Guns N' Roses » Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond) » 511 weeks ago
I don't think that's a fair comparison. AC/DC making a low budget, 40-minute album about pussy and partying is hardly a guy rebuilding a band from scratch to make an ambitious art rock record.
I hear you, but then whose idea was it to move away from guitar based rock and into Synth and NiN style sounds? Who rejected every song presented to him by the people who wrote the classic albums for several years? Who made himself uncontactable, only showed up in the dead of night, and hid behind a wall of Brazilian handlers until the partners he founded the band with and turned into employees quit in utter desperation? None of these ideas come from the label.
The producers may not have been good choices by the label, but those guys only even have those jobs because they've done well at getting good commercial records out artists before. It's not like this happens every time - Axl's own problems have to have at least contributed.
All I'm saying is, the fan base has moved from "Axl is the devil - everything is his fault" to "Axl is a Saint - the label is the devil" and the reality has to be in-between those positions.
All of these problems date from when Axl got full control of the band, that's not a co-incidence.
However the situation is somewhat of a "perfect storm" in that at the same time the labels were undergoing terrible restructures and industry wide meltdowns that ended up putting undue pressure on them to make the GNR record worth the sunk cost.
These days the label should be easier to work with, and Axl seems to have got on top of some of his demons too. However all I was saying is I would be surprised if he is able pull of multiple releases at speed now as it's really never been his work style. No disrespect to him intended in saying that - dude is a genius and the songs are amazing - hell I even think CD is amongst his best work.
#1354 Re: Guns N' Roses » Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond) » 511 weeks ago
Blame the label...not Axl. If Axl had got what he wanted, we'd have had the album 15 years ago and likely the followup a year or two later.
I'm not saying that the label doesn't bear a lot of the responsibility also, but it's odd to me to dismiss Axl's involvement altogether. Why didn't this happen to metallica? To Ac/Dc? to every other act then if it's just the label?
GNR is the only band with this sort of a history, and while the label I'm sure made life hard, some of that has to do with the plans Axl made and with his responses to disapproval.
It amazes me when I see people say GNR doesn't warrant a 2 disc compilation.
They have plenty of great songs for a 2 disc set.
The issue is more that GH are useful for bands like Aerosmith or Ac/Dc that have a long and convoluted catalogue of full albums. You know the kind - 17 records from the past and you just want something like the hits setlist they play live.
GNR has basically 4 records of originals. So it's odd to buy a 2 disc set to assemble the hits when you could just buy a 4 disc set and have essentially the whole catalogue!
Well nearly anyway.
#1355 Re: The Garden » 2016 Presidential Election Thread » 511 weeks ago
In short Hillary is crook playing for her mates on wall st, and Tump is a fool who would be nowhere without his inherited wealth.
How about you guys start over and give us some new options please 
#1356 Re: Guns N' Roses » Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond) » 511 weeks ago
I think it's the label AND Axl.
Like the label rejects the album AS IS - which they would do to a lot of bands who fundamentally changed their sound and altered the classic line up with players in a very different style.
But rather than work up new songs Axl goes into a spiral of self doubt and begins redoing things over and over. Also - Axl's way of recording caused the release to become important to the label - his method of booking the studio for months on end in case that was the night he worked. The way Brain decided to record in a temple because it was GNR. Wracking up those kinds of bills puts pressure on the label for the album to have hits - then you get upset when they tell you that you havn't made a pop rock record.
That's the other thing - the label are no doubt tools - but I think Axl's strategy in negotiations is "give me what I want or go fuck yourself for a few years". Look at the way he boycotted the eventual release. Basically I think they have a meeting with the label - and when they're not given limitless marketing money or tour support or whatever then they walk out and do nothing for 2 years until a new offer is on the table.
#1357 Re: Guns N' Roses » Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond) » 511 weeks ago
There's also the question of Ac/Dc.
Cliff announcing his retirement almost suggests he knows Axl and Angus will continue. I mean why formally retire as the bass player if the whole band is wrapping it up this tour?
#1358 Re: Guns N' Roses » Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond) » 511 weeks ago
monkeychow wrote:Don't forget to add the "Axl Tax" which is 2 years to each of those dates
Arguably one of the biggest factors in the delayed release of Chinese Democracy was that the label didn't fully buy into the idea of Axl's rebooted GN'R. Between record company execs getting cold feet and managers continually trying to force a reunion (and band members getting understandably sick of the delays, quitting and needing to be replaced), the process was dragged out unnecessarily over several years.
That's really not going to be an issue with an Axl/Slash/Duff line-up. They could fart into a microphone and the suits would release it in a heartbeat.
I'm sure that's a factor....behind a lot of the delays....but I've just noticed ideas in GNR often seem to happen around 2 years after inception....BD release was around 2 years after the aborted london cinema run from memory, the chinese album came out in 2008 which was around 2 years after Axl's big return in 2006....the UYI vocals took 2 years from the delivery of the finished instrumentals....hell even this reunion took 2 years to go public from when bumblefoot knew and quit!!!
I guess Axl seems pretty motivated at the moment between kicking ass on these shows and with Ac/Dc...but I dunno if I think Team Brazil is going to fast track stuff....I mean people in this thread are talking about a GH, then a new, album and a dvd, all during the next year and while on tour. Where's the precedent for that in GNR history...it's more than they did even back in the day.
#1359 Re: Guns N' Roses » Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond) » 511 weeks ago
I remember the sample we had of the electronic remix of This I Love had amazing high-pitched Axl vocals. The prospect of that vocal take mixed with a Slash solo does hype me up a little.
If they do persist on another HG I hope it has some things like that - a few treats so it's not just a release to avoid a real release.
#1360 Re: Guns N' Roses » Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond) » 511 weeks ago
I could see it being used to get out of contracts with the label, then Axl could form his own label with Slash and smash out whatever records they want.
But I agree a second GH is questionable, weirder when you consider it's 2 discs.
This is a band with 4 albums and 1 EP of originals.
There's already a covers album, and a live album, and a greatest hits.
How do you then make a new 2 disc GH? Might as well box up AFD and UYI1 in a 2 disc set and call it the greatest hits! Almost the Same thing!
These guys are too talented not to do something else. I mean Axl has tons of unfinished songs, Slash smashed out new riffs every 2 years for decades, it's really odd to think that rather than develop something new they'd just endlessly reissue catalogue stuff.
