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#461 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 318 weeks ago

PaSnow wrote:

Sorry I did mean to post the Boris Johnson into the regular Covid thread, a bit more topical to that.

No worries...I'd have probably not responded at all there...I thought the choice of putting it here was odd, but we've all made mistakes.

#462 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 318 weeks ago

PaSnow wrote:

And you people think his tax returns are irrelevant:  https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/donald-t … 13777.html

Donald Trump Has Stake In Hydroxychloroquine Drugmaker: Report


In addition, Sanofi’s largest shareholders include a mutual fund company run by major Republican donor Ken Fisher, the paper said.

Just so we're clear, no Democrats own ANYTHING that could be helped by any of this, right?  It's amazing what people choose to care about when it furthers their agenda...

#463 Re: The Garden » Covid 19 » 318 weeks ago

bigbri wrote:
buzzsaw wrote:
Sky Dog wrote:

Is it excessive or simple and eye opening? Fuck China.

If there's evidence of it, I'd love to see it.  I'm 100% behind fuck China, but I'm hesitant to get behind a random Facebook post as the reason to do so.  I posted this because I think there's something to some of it...not ready for the tin hat yet, but willing to listen if more gets uncovered to confirm this.

That post you pasted exaggerates facts. Beijing and Shanghai have indeed had cases, but not to the extent of other cities. But on the other hand, China enacted incredibly stringent, you might say ruthless, measures to restrict people. The hospitals built are only temporary, but impressive nonetheless. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ … s-outbreak They also were made with prefabricated units. https://www.businessinsider.com/how-chi … ays-2020-2

Their stock markets did take huge hits. https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-fact … SKBN21J6MT And their overall economy is going to contract for the first time since 1989. https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/24/economy/ … index.html

Has China fared better than the rest of the world? Probably, but if you believe the intelligence community they are likely fudging the numbers. And besides, they enacted measures that most people in Western countries would never willingly allow.

I like a good conspiracy theory. The X-Files is my all-time favorite series, and I have some fairly wacky conspiracy theories myself, but I'm not sure this is one.

I'm not surprised...it seems like almost everything on Facebook exaggerates facts (I'd argue it's not much different than some of the news media, though they usually share facts that support their agenda and leave out anything that might not).  I do believe that the overall point of the exaggerations isn't far off though.  This is a problem in society across the board for whatever reason...if you don't exaggerate, it's just not interesting enough to get clicks.  I don't blame the media for doing what they do...they are for profit.  I wish they just gave all the facts and let people think for themselves, but I don't think we're ever going back to those days (if those days ever really existed...I have my doubts about that too).

I don't believe the numbers coming out of China.  There's more to the story than we know (I've been saying this for a while).  I don't pretend to know what that is, but eventually everything will come out and I hope they are dealt with appropriately by the entire world, not just the US.

#464 Re: The Garden » Covid 19 » 318 weeks ago

Sky Dog wrote:

Is it excessive or simple and eye opening? Fuck China.

If there's evidence of it, I'd love to see it.  I'm 100% behind fuck China, but I'm hesitant to get behind a random Facebook post as the reason to do so.  I posted this because I think there's something to some of it...not ready for the tin hat yet, but willing to listen if more gets uncovered to confirm this.

#465 Re: The Garden » Covid 19 » 318 weeks ago

Copied this off of Facebook - a little crazy but some interesting points in between the excessive conspiracy...

________________________________________________________________________________

The coronavirus traveled all over the world from Wuhan China, but it did not reach Beijing or Shanghai or other major cities in China. Can anyone explain how is that possible?
There are so many questions, after all, where it all started, in China, the Chinese stock market did not collapse, but the American and European markets did, and when those markets collapsed, the Chinese bought a lot.
All roads lead back to China
1. They created a virus for which they already had an antidote.
2. They purposely spread the virus for financial gain.
3. There is a clear demonstration of efficiency to such an extent that they built hospitals in a few days. To build so many hospitals they had to be prepared with organized projects, for example, with the ordering of equipment, the hiring of labor, the water and sewerage network, the prefabricated building materials and the storage in an impressive volume.  Everything happened so fast that everyone was speechless.
4. They caused chaos in the world, beginning with Europe and the rest of the western worlds.
5. Quickly decimating the economies of dozens of countries.
6. Stop production and manufacturing lines in factories and primary production in dozens of countries.
7. Causing the stock markets to crash and then they bought stocks, bonds and companies at bargain prices.
8. They then quickly gained control of the epidemic in their country.  After all, they were ready and he was never really out of control.
9. In all this, they managed to lower the price of basic products, including the price of oil.
10. Now they are going back to mass production while the rest of the world is stopped.
Also note how quickly Chinese unions activated to "hoard" purchases of bus cargo to regional shopping centers across Australia, stripping our shelves of toilet paper and staple foods.
It happened before most of us knew what was happening, even before we knew what the Coronavirus was.

#466 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 318 weeks ago

PaSnow wrote:
buzzsaw wrote:
PaSnow wrote:

Boris Johnson moved to ICU.

People are going to die.  Roughly 2-3% of those testing positive meaning likely far less than 1% of the population because the rest of us aren't even getting tested.  They are inflating the numbers by listing it as the cause of death for anyone positive regardless of the reason they died.  People die every day from a multitude of things.  Are we just supposed to stop living and sit at home for the rest of our lives?  There's no chance people will do that through the summer. 

Fear is an ugly thing and it makes people extremely mentally unstable.  I'm way more worried about what happens if people don't come to their senses and get back to normal life than I am the virus.

Thats a pretty abstract post for just 'Boris Johnson placed in ICU'

A 'wow, ashame, hope he makes out ok' wouldve been nice

Why, because he's more important than someone's grandmother in ICU?  People are going to die.  Some people we will know, some none of us will know.  I didn't know this guy warranted additional attention in a US politics thread.

#467 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 318 weeks ago

mitchejw wrote:
buzzsaw wrote:
PaSnow wrote:

Boris Johnson moved to ICU.

People are going to die.  Roughly 2-3% of those testing positive meaning likely far less than 1% of the population because the rest of us aren't even getting tested.  They are inflating the numbers by listing it as the cause of death for anyone positive regardless of the reason they died.  People die every day from a multitude of things.  Are we just supposed to stop living and sit at home for the rest of our lives?  There's no chance people will do that through the summer. 

Fear is an ugly thing and it makes people extremely mentally unstable.  I'm way more worried about what happens if people don't come to their senses and get back to normal life than I am the virus.

In other words...let em die fer dem minimum wage jobs!

Nope, but since you obviously can't read, this response doesn't surprise me at all.  Continue with your ignorance.

#468 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 318 weeks ago

PaSnow wrote:

Boris Johnson moved to ICU.

People are going to die.  Roughly 2-3% of those testing positive meaning likely far less than 1% of the population because the rest of us aren't even getting tested.  They are inflating the numbers by listing it as the cause of death for anyone positive regardless of the reason they died.  People die every day from a multitude of things.  Are we just supposed to stop living and sit at home for the rest of our lives?  There's no chance people will do that through the summer. 

Fear is an ugly thing and it makes people extremely mentally unstable.  I'm way more worried about what happens if people don't come to their senses and get back to normal life than I am the virus.

#469 Re: The Garden » Covid 19 » 318 weeks ago

This is an opinion piece, but I agree with most of it and it aligns with what I've been saying the whole time.  Somewhere we lost the balance.

https://www.am1100theflag.com/opinion/1 … SPaQ7M7cW8

I've gotten to the point where I feel that we've gone too far in playing it safe against the Coronavirus. Don't get me wrong. Some caution and personal responsibility are a good thing. But we are creating millions of people who sit at home shivering in fear as they lose their jobs, fitness, socialization and savings. There is a tremendous societal cost to this with the resulting addiction, suicide, hopelessness and isolation. These are harder to quantify but calls to suicide lines are up 3x. Read up on plasma and hydroxychloroquine. Great early results, and Cuomo said this morning that 20% of the ventilators in NY are sitting idle not being used. Most of us won't get it and if we do we won't know. If we DO get it, likely we'll get better. Listen to me. I'm not saying this is nothing. Never have. But you "all or nothings" out there have to realize there is a balance point here. 25% of small business people tell US Chamber they're on the verge of closing for good.

I'm biased here cause I'm in ownership but even if you hate small business owners, how about those who got a call last week saying your job is gone?

Unemployment? Please. That's no model for the dignity of doing your job well and won't make you whole financially.  If Walmart can be open today with spacing restrictions then so can Kohl's. Let gyms set up new schedules, max 10 people and close every hour to clean. Let restaurants open with space between tables. Let theaters sell half the tickets with chairs in between.

There are ways to do this responsibly. Losing lives is awful. But remember comorbidity. Many of those dying were dying from other things before this came along. Losing freedom, health, commerce, savings, and opportunity is awful too.   In a societal context, we understand we are part of a system. If I'm susceptible to something, I have the freedom to say don't come to visit me I might catch something or I might give it to you. In a free society we let the people make these decisions, not the government.  You also have the right to dig a hole in your backyard and jump in it where you have no risk. If you're scared to go out to eat then don't do it. When government limits your constitutional rights, you stand in a danger zone, and that's what is happening.

Not saying anyone has to agree with me. And there are good points on both sides. But we've swung the balance too far. New York Mills should not be run like New York City. We've set a new world record in playing it safe. We need to have something to come back to after this is over.

#470 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 318 weeks ago

mitchejw wrote:

I don't see a third question so I'll just feign retardation.

This alone explains everything.   Thank you for finally admitting it!

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