Stephven you call on America's founding fathers as a worthy inspiration to us all, yet they were slave owners who used fears of Catholicism to ignite waves of bigotry and persecution that they then aimed at the British.

You call us all out for complacency in a system that inherently possesses forces of evil, but you invoke the spirits of people who saw thousands enslaved, an entire race of people systematically eliminated from this Earth (native americans), and watched as the Sons of Liberty tar and feather any British loyalist they could find.

The US didn't rebel against Britain because of freedom, they did it because of money. And the men designing that revolution were willing to spend lives with little more than a second thought to do so.

War involves atrocities. Always.

If your stance is for pacifism, have the balls to say so. But don't try to paint the world a different shade today than it was 250 years ago.

The only difference between now and then is that you're here now and you weren't then. Righteous men such as yourselves like to pretend that their time is unique in its audacity, so you see you're committing the very fallacy you say you have sworn to eliminate from your life - dishonesty. You're twisting and perverting the nature of modernity to avoid the bigger picture - that however regrettable and disgusting some of the things that are done in the course of war, they are inevitable to a certain degree. To use your own crude language, you're being a coward.

We can fight to limit the abuses of power and overuse of force, we cannot eliminate it.

The reason we're not screaming for the military's head over WikiLeaks is that, all things considered, the military's doing an okay job.

Historically speaking our current occupations are more respectful of the natives and civilians than most others were. And to disband and displace the US as a world power would leave that window open for another nation to seize that advantage as the world's greatest military.

Is that what you want?

I admire your Kantian priorities really I do, but you admit yourself to be somewhat distanced from others and the world, so I ask you to consider the possibility that you've lost the capacity to think realistically about a world that will always contain evil.

Your life, like mine, is sufficiently comfortable that on a day-to-day basis we can forget what evil really is, and forget it's there (along with pain, sacrifice, honor, suffering).

In that bubble we can pretend in the idea of a perfect world, where the things WikiLeaks exposes would not happen. But such a world is as make believe as our perception of the existence of self. And equally harmful.

The most noble ambitions - to rid the world of dishonesty and evil - can lead us down the most destructive paths in life. Indeed, the war in Iraq is a good example of an administration with good intent (democracy in the middle east) overestimating the capacity of itself and the world, and the results have been disastrous.

Don't be like Bush, and be brave enough to accept the truth of war. Otherwise you're as bad for the world as they are.

So what is this nut job willing to sacrifice for his crusade for truth?  Is he willing to leave the comfort of his home to make the change he feels enlightened and righteous that he champions?  Cause without force and sacrifice, you're nothing more than an acne faced teenager sucking the tit of his mother while you live in the basement.  You want to change the world, you'll have to get past me and 2 million other armed and willing combatants who have no problem leaving the safety net we've provided for you.  Until that point, please return to fantasia and let the adults get back to work.

In all sincerity I can no longer engage in conversation with you. You obviously posses an IQ below 100 as you are unable to formulate coherent ideas.  Your dependence on logical fallacies, namely ad hominem attacks demonstrate that your mind is not capable of handling the Socratic method.

Let me make this clear to you.  I don't care about some global community where all are considered equal.  I care about the united states and keeping it at the top of the food chain.

I care about the American quality and way of life.  And I'm willing to do things you can't imagine to keep America at the top, to include laying down my life.

If that desire makes me weak, or a coward, so be it. But what does it make you when you hide behind a computer and do nothing to produce actual change.  Who's really being delusional and buying into the bullshit?

If Randall is weak and cowardly, then I would be honored to be referred to as the same.  Nothing he is doing is weak or cowardly.  I am the weak and cowardly one because while I value everything he does, he is willing to risk his life to protect it and I am not.

NikkiSixx
 
In the middle of making documentary about my book "This is gonna hurt" and Sixx:A.M. album of same name...This project has so many layers. 2 minutes ago via web

BECAUSE your military cannot take down a single site.
This is where my participation in the debate stops as you clearly have zero knowledge on US cyber tactics and aren't even willing to read about it. For you to claim I have no idea what I'm talking about when you could have did a 2 second google search to lead you to some areas that would discuss these things showing I am right is laughable.

You're just one of those people aboard the wikileaks bandwagon since its a hot issue and are now an armchair expert even though you lack basic knowledge on issues you attempt to offer a rebuttal to. Its why you have to run to the insult well so often during the course of the debate.

I post quotes from Gates showing his position on Wikileaks, I'm labeled a coward.

I show you that the US has the capabilities to take wikileaks down if it decides to and even tell you where to look for such information, I'm told I don't know how the internet works.

This could have been an interesting debate but its simply not worth the effort of posting when me(or anyone) simply get insulted for posting facts that you don't agree with.

It's pretty difficult to argue with the crazy.  If you're posting information from a biased site, you cannot expect others to not do the same...unless you're implying that wikileaks isn't picking and choosing what it releases.

The only difference between the current world and the past world is the internet.  This same shit has been going on since the dawn of time.  It's only a big deal now because some website can post whatever it wants to the internet that supports their agenda.  Nothing is new, it's just easier to try to brainwash the masses.

Lets see your UNBIASED sources. Are you not getting whats going on around you ?

So those who disagree have to show UNBIASED sources while you and those who agree get to show biased sources?

Too funny...

Like I said, become an advocate of the US disbanding NATO since you think the US doesn't protect you. Billions can be saved on both sides of the pond.

I have looked at the facts. Its crystal clear that you haven't though.

There has been on information that would endanger american lives leaked. The only people threatened are the same government and news outlets you are puppeting here

Interesting, as you seem to be spouting the same defensive anti European pro military right bullshit.

Funny that someone who doesn't support wikileaks is labeled as that.

This is where my participation in the debate stops as you clearly have zero knowledge on US cyber tactics and aren't even willing to read about it. For you to claim I have no idea what I'm talking about when you could have did a 2 second google search to lead you to some areas that would discuss these things showing I am right is laughable.

You're just one of those people aboard the wikileaks bandwagon since its a hot issue and are now an armchair expert even though you lack basic knowledge on issues you attempt to offer a rebuttal to. Its why you have to run to the insult well so often during the course of the debate.

I post quotes from Gates showing his position on Wikileaks, I'm labeled a coward.

I show you that the US has the capabilities to take wikileaks down if it decides to and even tell you where to look for such information, I'm told I don't know how the internet works.

This could have been an interesting debate but its simply not worth the effort of posting when me(or anyone) simply get insulted for posting facts that you don't agree with.