Dude I understand your point that you feel betrayed as a fan given your clearly a big supporter of the new music - but please - there's no need to feel the need to knock Slash to do it. Slash is recgonised the world over as an iconic and important guitarist in the history of rock music and blues-rock - so people who idolise him and are fans of AFD should not be called idiots.

Myself I'm a MASSIVE fan of both Slash's guitar playing skills - in and out of GNR - and Also Axl's musical abilities - both as a songwriter, frontman, vocalist and lyricist. So I don't feel the need to bash one side because I love the other - I love them both.

Anyway. As far as Axl and Beta - as with any form of relationship - it's hard to know what goes on in it from the outside. It's obvious that Axl cares for her deeply, and I would guess that she has probably provided a lot of emotional support to him - support that he may not have been able to get from blood relatives and other friends. Likewise - it's clear that Axl himself, as with many geniuses has a personality that is not easily understood or simplistic to deal with. Of course with people of wealth and emotional vunerablitiy there is always the risk that they will be taken advantage of. At the end of the day its going to be Axl's call i guess - if he gets enough out of it to justify whatever he puts in himself.

I can also understand why Beta would get pissed off. I mean she knows Axl as a man - a human - you know - a friend around the house - and we all know people on the net like to talk a lot of shit about him. Some deserved maybe, but a hell of a lot of it not so much too. I know my back would get up if people insulted my close friends and family as casually as many rock fans insult their idols.

What this says to me is that the band needs to hire "professionals" to deal with the fan base. People who are not emotionally invested (like Axl and Beta) in the band and so will not be personally hurt during normal interactions with the community.

I'm really glad you raised this as I've been considering this same senario for a few months.

Firstly on just a personal level:

The pros:

I LOVE the original AFD. But when playing it compared to a newer album....the recording quality itself (NOT the peformance) sounds very anagolue and tape based or whatever. Now to an old school fan like me - in a way that is part of the magic - the same way when you chuck on an old vinal and the hiss and pop just adds a bit of flavour it it all. However...that said...I listen to the instrument seperation on something like The Spagetti Incident (which is still old now) or more modern albums like Angel Down and so forth, and I can't help but wonder how bad ass AFD would have sounded if it was a modern album in the sence of modern productin values.

The Cons:

I don't mean this as a bash. But what would we get? Love him or hate him now - the AFD record is what launched Slash as an iconic blues rock guitarist with signature licks. Studio versions of the AFD tracks without Slash is like removing a very strong part of what made them awesome songs - so that's a bad start. Then there's axl. I love him to death - but is his voice as strong in 2008 as in the early 1980s? I'm not saying his voice is bad now at all - I really dig him live still - i'm just saying - is it an idea to record note for note the same songs you did 20+ years ago for comparision. Part of the character in those songs came from Axl's young man anger I would have thought. So we'd get an axl with maybe a higher range...but slightly weaker tone...yet produced better...but more relaxed as a human?

Then what else would be added? Orcherstation or Synth parts? On songs from the sleazy LA Streets of the 80s? We know if fink is on there he'll add a bunch of industrial dischords and dissonece...which is cool on like the leak of CD...but which will really excentuate the removal of the classic blues lines. What else would be added? Some awesome shred outros on nighttrain from BBF or Bucket...and a bunch of guitar tapfests? Would be kinda cool in a rock out way...but given the historical brillaince of these songs...I dunno...to be honest I can see these versions being an utter mess and disgrace.

Which would create a condundrum. Listen to the nicely recorded version that sounds pretty but with the wrong peformances or listen to a ancient tapey recording of the 'true versions' of the songs. I'd be going for the latter I think.

The problem is - unless they played it nuiance for nuiance - note for note - what's the damn point - I keep trying to explain to people - the guitar lines are like the lyrics in these songs - fans know them phrase for phrase - when you get to the solo and its not as the air guitar version in your head plays out - a part of the mind rebels - and that's why people hate fink. I refrence that SCOM version on big daddy. It just sounds "wrong" to me - its like a cover thats scarily close to the original in places and its just a mind fuck. Immagine how much worse that will be when Axl redoes the entire vocal lines. maybe he says a few words with different emphasis this time around - which version will you sing in your head !! FUCK THAT!

OK...so i want to move onto the philosophical level:

What is Axl's motivation for doing this? Does he really hate the old guys so much he wants to undo history? OR is it just he was never happy with the recording process at the time? I could understand the latter but not the former.

What would it do for the band's credibility? I think axl felt having them record and play the old songs makes them more GNR. I think to most fans though it makes them less so - and more posing. They didn't do AFD and we fucking know it. Move On. Release albums like the CD leaks with the kickass songs they DID do - tour those - (with the obivous greatest hits covers they'd be expected to add in live as GNR) and then they'll be legit as GNR. So i feel pulling a stunt like this would just make the absence of Izzy, Slash and Duff more noticiable.

Philosophically I think it's evil to confuse newer fans to. Immagine in 2017 - does a kid who hears anything from the old school past (the way i'll hear an ancient Robert Johnston track) get to hear Slash on Paradice Ciry or Robin and Richard? This becomes especially important if someone gets hold of the rights to the old versions in the future (after the deaths of band members) and hoards them or soemthing. I guess thats a bit paranoid. its just like I don't think tis a cool idea to fuck with history.

Then again - could this be like the movies? How would it be recieved? When psycho was remade shot for shot - the critial reaction was like 'Why did you bother" and i suspect it would be like that again. Then again i have a friend who will only watch that version of psycho. But contrast that with reboots. Sure the old fans like us bitch about them, But many of the movie reboots have been accepted as commerical successes - and now would borderline replace the original in the minds of young fans who don't know better. Like ask the average 15 yo about Amityville and I'd guess they'd know the Ryan Reynolds version. Is axl some kind of bizzare genius idea - to take that same model - of a concept you can reboot - from storeis to music - is AFD going to be the rebooted music album? Where you take the same songs - add modern special effetcs, pacing and some new actors and introduce it to a whole new generation? And if he does - would he con the general public into it? Or would more people react like me above and think of it as a peversion of nature?

I can't lie...i'd have to listen to it for the macarbe interest value..so i'd end up getting it...but its beyond insulting to the old band...and a terrible idea....Axl has so much new music that's interesting...like Catcher in the Rye...he'd be better to finish that stuff off and blow us all away with it!

I agree totally.

At first I was a bit worried because I thought leaking SR so close to an offical release of the song is kinda not good business for the band. And as fans of the band which we all are (including MSL) we really shouldn't be doing stuff that could potentially upset the official release.

But now that I realise MSL's master aim was more to end the situation where some fans have a bunch of songs that they keep secret and play alone in their bedrooms, and just basicly to put all the stuff some fans have out there for all the fans....and i agree with that - it's madness that any of this hoarding stuff started at all.

The whole idea of a fan community is to share and talk about the experience of really digging a band with other people who also get it. And its sad that some people have such a need to feel special by being exclusive that they would deprive others of songs that are bound to have been important in their lives.

In the end I hope GNR is able to release finished versions of all this stuff and put an end to this mess.

I think Axl wants robin back though or we would have got a statement talking about how robin is a paid employee and how he's delayed the album in the past with his divided loyalities and how its great that he's moved on to NIN again.

Instead they gave a crypic "we're waiting to see" kinda answer that implies they want to leave him breathing room to return. Likewise robin is doing that by clearly pissing off yet not making any anti-gnr statements publicly that could hinder a patch-up.

Who knows...when he grows his hair back...he could well return to the band....

I'd just like to see something happening. I really hope that SR is the beginning of the album release...and that then we'll get some kind of tour with Ron and Richard at least.

Very true. I was thinking like - usually when stuff comes back it's slightly different. Like how in 70s girls wore low cut pants and flares...and they brought elements of that style back in the late 90s early 00s with the hipster craze and all that.

I figure a song like song 2 is retro enough to evoke images of classics like November Rain...but produced modern enough to not be mistaken for an old song and thus kinda still be edgy.