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tejastech08
 Rep: 194 

Re: Rock Hall 2011 Eligible: Only Guns N Roses Would Make the Cut

tejastech08 wrote:
Communist China wrote:

'People pay attention to talent' is asserting that talent is a predictor of success. If you want to amend that and give some other reason why people paying attention to Axl is different than the many more who pay attention to Bon Jovi, feel free. But don't pretend you haven't been flipping your argument based on who you're applying it to. All you've really managed to say in your many posts in here is that you like GnR, and you don't like Bon Jovi.

I will admit that was too simplified of a statement. Make no mistake, Axl was lucky as shit to get noticed in the first place. How many great musicians out there never get the chance he did? If popularity was a true sign of quality, then why did Citizen Kane flop in theaters and then end up being regarded decades later as one of the greatest films ever by most critics and film historians? Once Axl did get noticed, people weren't going to ignore him.

Communist China
 Rep: 130 

Re: Rock Hall 2011 Eligible: Only Guns N Roses Would Make the Cut

I think Citizen Kane is a great point, similar to how The Archies had the top single of 69 even with the Beatles, Stones, Zeppelin, and other historic bands were around then. There's obviously no perfect gauge of quality, but time is a big test.

Bon Jovi has had HUGE albums, singles, and tours in 3 separate decades, and their 80s hits still get radio play and are loved by millions. They've stood the test of time, so I think it's pretty silly to call their initial success a fluke.

tejastech08
 Rep: 194 

Re: Rock Hall 2011 Eligible: Only Guns N Roses Would Make the Cut

tejastech08 wrote:
Communist China wrote:

I think Citizen Kane is a great point, similar to how The Archies had the top single of 69 even with the Beatles, Stones, Zeppelin, and other historic bands were around then. There's obviously no perfect gauge of quality, but time is a big test.

Bon Jovi has had HUGE albums, singles, and tours in 3 separate decades, and their 80s hits still get radio play and are loved by millions. They've stood the test of time, so I think it's pretty silly to call their initial success a fluke.

It definitely wasn't a fluke. I just think it's laughable to claim that something like "Livin' On A Prayer" is on the level of the likes of Zeppelin, Floyd, the Beatles, Queen, et al. That's why earlier in the thread I asked the other dude who he was comparing it to when he said it was an all-time great rock song. I think it's an all-time popular rock song, but all-time great? Can't agree with that assessment.

Re: Rock Hall 2011 Eligible: Only Guns N Roses Would Make the Cut

Lomax wrote:
tejastech08 wrote:

I just think it's laughable to claim that something like "Livin' On A Prayer" is on the level of the likes of Zeppelin, Floyd, the Beatles, Queen, et al.

...

Weakest argument ever.


What if I was to take a really shitty Zeppelin song something off in through the out door, or a crappy Queen song some deep cut from from the late 80s and compare that with These Days or Keep the faith ( the songs) ????

The fact is Jovis best is better than Queen and Zeppelins worst, its on par with their good stuff. Whether or not the scale the same heights as the other two in their good stuff is debatable but you could build a good argument to say they come close. That's not to be scoffed at.

tejastech08
 Rep: 194 

Re: Rock Hall 2011 Eligible: Only Guns N Roses Would Make the Cut

tejastech08 wrote:
Riad wrote:
tejastech08 wrote:

I just think it's laughable to claim that something like "Livin' On A Prayer" is on the level of the likes of Zeppelin, Floyd, the Beatles, Queen, et al.

...

Weakest argument ever.


What if I was to take a really shitty Zeppelin song something off in through the out door, or a crappy Queen song some deep cut from from the late 80s and compare that with These Days or Keep the faith ( the songs) ????

The fact is Jovis best is better than Queen and Zeppelins worst, its on par with their good stuff. Whether or not the scale the same heights as the other two in their good stuff is debatable but you could build a good argument to say they come close. That's not to be scoffed at.

You can tip the scales as much as you want, but the phrase used earlier in the thread was "all-time great song." By that standard, I'm gonna compare it to the BEST of Zeppelin, Beatles, Stones, Queen, etc. and it's a tough deal for any 80's rock band to come close to those legendary songs from the 60's and 70's. That was the golden era for rock music.

misterID
 Rep: 470 

Re: Rock Hall 2011 Eligible: Only Guns N Roses Would Make the Cut

misterID wrote:

Bon Jovi should not be mentioned with the likes of The Beatles, Queen and The Stones. But to each his own.

Re: Rock Hall 2011 Eligible: Only Guns N Roses Would Make the Cut

Lomax wrote:
tejastech08 wrote:
Riad wrote:
tejastech08 wrote:

I just think it's laughable to claim that something like "Livin' On A Prayer" is on the level of the likes of Zeppelin, Floyd, the Beatles, Queen, et al.

...

Weakest argument ever.


What if I was to take a really shitty Zeppelin song something off in through the out door, or a crappy Queen song some deep cut from from the late 80s and compare that with These Days or Keep the faith ( the songs) ????

The fact is Jovis best is better than Queen and Zeppelins worst, its on par with their good stuff. Whether or not the scale the same heights as the other two in their good stuff is debatable but you could build a good argument to say they come close. That's not to be scoffed at.

You can tip the scales as much as you want, but the phrase used earlier in the thread was "all-time great song." By that standard, I'm gonna compare it to the BEST of Zeppelin, Beatles, Stones, Queen, etc. and it's a tough deal for any 80's rock band to come close to those legendary songs from the 60's and 70's. That was the golden era for rock music.

You're comparing Bon Jovi's worst to Zeppelin and Queens best when you compare Living on a prayer.

Why not compare bon jovi's best to Queen and Zeppelins best? These days, keep the faith, something to believe in hey god  You give love a bad name Wanted, Happy Now.  Those are the cream of the crop. It's only fair that they would be the songs used for comparson

I don't think the time period has anything to do with the actual music.

Re: Rock Hall 2011 Eligible: Only Guns N Roses Would Make the Cut

Lomax wrote:
misterID wrote:

Bon Jovi should not be mentioned with the likes of The Beatles, Queen and The Stones. But to each his own.

Why not?

tejastech08
 Rep: 194 

Re: Rock Hall 2011 Eligible: Only Guns N Roses Would Make the Cut

tejastech08 wrote:
Riad wrote:

You're comparing Bon Jovi's worst to Zeppelin and Queens best when you compare Living on a prayer.

Why not compare bon jovi's best to Queen and Zeppelins best? These days, keep the faith, something to believe in hey god  You give love a bad name Wanted, Happy Now.  Those are the cream of the crop. It's only fair that they would be the songs used for comparson

I don't think the time period has anything to do with the actual music.

There has been a severe downward trend in the quality of music since the end of the 70's IMHO, so there is something to it. That being said, the Bon Jovi songs you mentioned are a joke compared to the best of Zeppelin, Beatles, Stones, Queen, Floyd, etc. Besides, I was only comparing based on what someone else in this thread said about "Livin' On A Prayer" being an all-time great song.

In any event, we are way off-topic at this point. Bottom line is that if the likes of Madonna are allowed into a Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, then the likes of KISS and Bon Jovi should also be in. The voting at the Hall of Fame is pretty subjective though, obviously. Look how long it took Van Halen to get in.

metallex78
 Rep: 192 

Re: Rock Hall 2011 Eligible: Only Guns N Roses Would Make the Cut

metallex78 wrote:

I'd put Bon Jovi's Dry County up there against Led Zep and Queen, and Bed of Roses is up there with November Rain.

And I'd easily categorize Livin' On A Prayer alongside Sweet Child or any other classic rock song from that era. Both get major props whenever I hear them get played in public venues.

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