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mitchejw
 Rep: 129 

Re: Current Events Thread

mitchejw wrote:

Oh the horror…

I can’t see the article but anything Pre-K is a private school. Not public.

After school clubs like the gay-straight alliance existed in my school too.

None of this moves the needle for me.

It’s all over reaction. You don’t think kids lie to their parents without being involved in these clubs?

The way things are currently couldn’t be any more unhealthy. Sweeping things under the rug and pretending like things don’t exist it’s more putting your head in the sand bullshit.

Life is hard. You have to change.

mitchejw
 Rep: 129 

Re: Current Events Thread

mitchejw wrote:
Axl S wrote:

Mitch, maybe accidentally, touched on a sort of good moral point when he said parents aren't always right. Not one really to debate but to reflect on.

I remember getting taught about the civil rights and suffragette movements when I was growing up. I also remember as part of divinity studies getting taught about various different religons, their beliefs and practices. I also remember being taught about contraception, despite going to a Catholic school, because it was part of the national curriculum and had to be taught.

If I had parents whose personal viewpoints disagreed with any of those topics, or disagreed with me being taught about them, are they in the right if they complain to the school or government and demand I am not taught about them? By modern standards learning that racism is bad, women being able to vote is good and knowning about safe sex practices all seem like sensible things to be taught. Rewind like just 10-20 years before I was in school and some would have objected to those things being mentioned.



On the topic at hand. I don't see how it's harmful to explain to kids that some people are born a boy or girl but later realise they are more comfortable identifying the opposite way. Also, don't see how it's harmful to acknowledge that some kids in the class might have two moms or two dads instead of a mom & dad.

I don't know the extent of the education being offered in various states in the US, but those two key points can be delivered in an uncontroversial and age appropriate manner and it seems really close minded to say that they can't be. Schools don't just teach kids maths, literature, languages and science. They also teach kids about the modern world we live in, about society and prepare them for life in general. It's why schools also teach things like cooking etc. as well.

You started off with a kind word. Thank you for that.

I think you, perhaps more eloquently, articulated what i was trying to get at…

Despite what some others say, i think it’s absolutely a pertinent point.

misterID
 Rep: 472 

Re: Current Events Thread

misterID wrote:

Side-stepping Mitch. I’m sure you’re okay with teachers telling your kids to lie to you. Or brining your child into a club under false pretenses, not because they asked for it or actively sought it out.

No one is pretending things don’t exist, but at the very least, a parent has the right to opt their kid out of these things.

mitchejw
 Rep: 129 

Re: Current Events Thread

mitchejw wrote:
misterID wrote:

Side-stepping Mitch. I’m sure you’re okay with teachers telling your kids to lie to you. Or brining your child into a club under false pretenses, not because they asked for it or actively sought it out.

No one is pretending things don’t exist, but at the very least, a parent has the right to opt their kid out of these things.

You act like it’s the rule and not the rare exception.

Either way, ignorant parents make for ignorant kids.

misterID
 Rep: 472 

Re: Current Events Thread

misterID wrote:

Edit: this is funnier than getting drawn into another ridiculous argument


monkeychow
 Rep: 644 

Re: Current Events Thread

monkeychow wrote:

My thinking is kinda like.....

For the most part humans are born with hearing and with ears. However sometimes someone is born with no ears, or with deformed ears, or ears that don't work. We find ways to integrate those people, help them fit in with the hearing world, and not be mean to them. But we don't try and say that they CAN hear....we don't try and say that there is no such thing as hearing or that ears are just a sociological invention.

I see sex somewhat the same. There are men and women. For the most part everyone is one or the other but every now and then someone is born with biological differences, so that they may have some unusual combination - such as a penis and ovaries together - or some of their parts may not be functioning in the normal ways. We should be nice to these people and find ways to include them. However that doesn't mean that there's no such thing as men and women in the first place.

I can't see why that's even a contentious issue to me.

As for other gender stuff, there is a social aspect to it as well as what's innate. Like I think about how tough my grandfather's whole generation was compared to mine. Some of it was they were raised and expected to be like that I think. So I think that's a factor in how we act as well. Or look at how socially women now are so much more overtly sexual (instagram etc) publicly than they were in the 1980s. There's aspects to men and women's behaviour that's biological but there's also trends and social pressures.

As for trans stuff.

I know there's real people with gender dysphoria. But it used to be rare. And lots of the modern cases seem to be people that would have fitted under the old order of things. Like we used to be able to have gay people who were certain they were male and just also liked other males. Some of them were effeminate sure but some of them were as tough seeming as any straight jock type. Likewise with lesbians there used to be glam lesbians and butch type lesbians but they didn't need to think they are the other gender. And then there were straight tomboy style girls too - who like men as much as any other girl but they just happen to like traditional male hobbies over girl stuff. And you have straight guys who like theatre and dance and stuff but don't think of themselves as women or want to be with a guy or anything - they just like some hobbies people associate with gayness.

These days we'd be in a rush to reassign all these people. It's almost like the definition of male and female has become narrower not wider.

mitchejw
 Rep: 129 

Re: Current Events Thread

mitchejw wrote:
misterID wrote:

Edit: this is funnier than getting drawn into another ridiculous argument


[/embed]
Thanks Howard Stern

mitchejw
 Rep: 129 

Re: Current Events Thread

mitchejw wrote:
monkeychow wrote:

My thinking is kinda like.....

For the most part humans are born with hearing and with ears. However sometimes someone is born with no ears, or with deformed ears, or ears that don't work. We find ways to integrate those people, help them fit in with the hearing world, and not be mean to them. But we don't try and say that they CAN hear....we don't try and say that there is no such thing as hearing or that ears are just a sociological invention.

I see sex somewhat the same. There are men and women. For the most part everyone is one or the other but every now and then someone is born with biological differences, so that they may have some unusual combination - such as a penis and ovaries together - or some of their parts may not be functioning in the normal ways. We should be nice to these people and find ways to include them. However that doesn't mean that there's no such thing as men and women in the first place.

I can't see why that's even a contentious issue to me.

As for other gender stuff, there is a social aspect to it as well as what's innate. Like I think about how tough my grandfather's whole generation was compared to mine. Some of it was they were raised and expected to be like that I think. So I think that's a factor in how we act as well. Or look at how socially women now are so much more overtly sexual (instagram etc) publicly than they were in the 1980s. There's aspects to men and women's behaviour that's biological but there's also trends and social pressures.

As for trans stuff.

I know there's real people with gender dysphoria. But it used to be rare. And lots of the modern cases seem to be people that would have fitted under the old order of things. Like we used to be able to have gay people who were certain they were male and just also liked other males. Some of them were effeminate sure but some of them were as tough seeming as any straight jock type. Likewise with lesbians there used to be glam lesbians and butch type lesbians but they didn't need to think they are the other gender. And then there were straight tomboy style girls too - who like men as much as any other girl but they just happen to like traditional male hobbies over girl stuff. And you have straight guys who like theatre and dance and stuff but don't think of themselves as women or want to be with a guy or anything - they just like some hobbies people associate with gayness.

These days we'd be in a rush to reassign all these people. It's almost like the definition of male and female has become narrower not wider.

I think this was a well thought out post.

When people begin to open themselves up to the idea that gender and sex are two different things i think they will be a profound moment in our country’s history.

Even more, when people realize that there is no bigger political voting bloc than the straight white male, they’ll understand why this is such a politically motivated discussion.

misterID
 Rep: 472 

Re: Current Events Thread

misterID wrote:
mitchejw wrote:
misterID wrote:

Edit: this is funnier than getting drawn into another ridiculous argument


[/embed]
Thanks Howard Stern

That was from a lesbian

misterID
 Rep: 472 

Re: Current Events Thread

misterID wrote:

A woman is a woman. A trans woman is a trans woman. They are biologically different. Men cannot give birth. Have periods. Or go through menopause.

Straight white men aren’t the only people who think this way or take issue with it. Only self hating white men who have been absolutely pussy-whipped think it’s all made up. Feminists, lesbians, blacks and Latinos think this way too. They don’t think biological men should compete in women sports, take away scholarships or prize money from women. They don’t think a boy wearing a skirt should be allowed in a girls locker room. They don’t think you should be canceled for saying these things aloud. That’s why democrats are losing them.

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