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#591 Re: The Garden » Current Events Thread » 256 weeks ago
Are all these Trumpists who are unseating 'centrists' heroes too?
Not in my opinion. Was AOC a hero when she ousted the 2nd most powerful Democrat in DC? I hold Greene with the same regard I do Omar. Both are fucking morons who peddle dangerous conspiracies and are exposed frauds.
I don’t understand your opposition to leaders that find common ground and legislate real change, rather than those who pontificate and accomplish nothing.
The reality is both of the bills Democrats have actually put forward and voted on are several years old bills they wrote in fantasy land. Republicans do it too, and the house has embodied this nuttiness since at least 2004, if not earlier. It’s really easy to pass a law you know has no chance of passing to drum up support. Republicans did this nonstop in the house from 2010-2016, repeatedly passing ACA repeals they knew had no chance in the Senate. Both voting rights bills are similar examples, but now they’re fucked cause they know it would be political suicide to ram through (this is what Manchin recognizes) and result in them not only decisively losing both chambers next year, but may cost Biden any chance in 24. To say nothing of the very real possibilities that many of their clauses would be struck down by SCOTUS. That’s the political calculus Schumer, Pelosi and Biden are considering. They’re not idiots.
The House infrastructure bill is the same way. It was passed as a political statement, and few who’ve actually read it can argue it’s economically plausible. If you haven’t noticed, the past two presidential elections have been decided on hate rather than support. I’m hoping both sides recognize the value in not demonizing each other and validating the hyperbole each accuses the other of. If you don’t piss people off, they’re less likely to show up to vote you out.
#592 Re: The Garden » Current Events Thread » 256 weeks ago
Maybe you falsely believe the ACA was in any way bipartisan or that a single Republican contributed to any part of the law? I don’t know where you get this notion of a bipartisan bill that was voted against by people who worked on it. Bottom line is without GOP support, nothing the extreme left wants will happen. So maybe meet in the middle and work on stuff the majority of people want, versus trying to reengineer the entire economy.
#593 Re: The Garden » Current Events Thread » 256 weeks ago
I think it’s safe to say if Schumer brings the bipartisan bill up, you’ll have 5 republicans and 5 democrats voting for it guaranteed, and however many of their party members want to join them. Contrasted with Warren who came out against any bill that doesn’t include paid daycare and climate reform. 10 senators are doing something that has a chance of becoming law.
#594 Re: The Garden » Current Events Thread » 256 weeks ago
Question ...when Manchin says no on the infrastructure package because he “doesn’t think they should go out alone will he still be a patriot and a hero?
Or even better...Manchin agrees to a deal but none have the Republicans voted for it...then they get to go back home and take credit for it anyways....are they true patriots ahd heroes too?
I believe he’s the most courageous politician in America at the moment. Democrats cheered McCain when he singlehandedly stopped the ACA repeal. Being brave isn’t something that comes with million dollar Nike contracts and adoration on Twitter.
Manchin is part of the 10 senators that allegedly have drafted a multi trillion dollar infrastructure bill. If Schumer refuses to bring that bill to the floor, or Pelosi refuses to bring it to a vote in the House, why is the narrative Republican obstruction?
#595 Re: The Garden » Current Events Thread » 256 weeks ago
I wouldn’t know. I know that a Voting Law is being debated with near universal Democratic support making it a federal crime for Illinois (or any other state) to ever attempt to require ID. A quick google search shows a political group campaigning for Voter ID in your state, but I don’t know the support they have. In my state, a bill was presented last week, that I strong support, and that improved the security of our elections.
So I’ll repeat my original statement that started this dialogue and state that the US is the only western democracy that doesn’t require a state issued ID to register and/or vote. Most states only require a utility bill for identification purposes, and one of our major political parties is actively trying to outlaw any form of ID to register or vote in 2021. In the most powerful nation on earth. A nation that is under constant bombardment of cyber attacks and encryption hacks.
#596 Re: The Garden » Current Events Thread » 256 weeks ago
Axl S wrote:misterID wrote:It's easy to get an ID, they just need to make sure everyone who wants one gets one. Community organizers would be good at this
Are the two IDs typically used in the US passport and driver's license? One simple solution to this that is probably easy to do is just make applying for and receiving a passport free.
Like you say, if they want to check IDs they need to just make sure it's easy for everyone to get one. And easy includes cost but also the process.
You haven’t gotten an answer to this question because the proponents don’t really know or care.
My state, Pennsylvania, allows people to register and vote with a utility bill. The answer has been stated throughout this entire thread. No one is ignoring anything, I personally just don’t like repeating myself, providing evidence of my citations, and being ignored and asked to repeat the process. But my sanity is in question, so here’s another link:
https://www.votespa.com/Register-to-Vot … oters.aspx
I can’t answer the requirements for every state. Your state of Illinois also only requires a utility bill:
https://www.illinois.gov/hfs/SiteCollec … sber19.pdf
I assume you knew this, so your statement is puzzling given that your own state doesn’t require ID to vote. And the fact you seem to be supporting AxlS’s false notion that a drivers license or passport is in anyway required to register, is even more perplexing giving the law in your own state. Maybe you didn’t know the requirements? In which case it may not be prudent to accuse others of such lack of knowledge.
#598 Re: The Garden » Current Events Thread » 257 weeks ago
Randall Flagg wrote:mitchejw wrote:Lol ok ID
What glorified city?
The one codified into federal law - Washington DC. The one you need an amendment to change, and has zero chance being approved by SCOTUS.
Ohhh that one...the one that has a population larger than like 10 states that have senators
Yep. Just like Puerto Rico and Guam. I’ve noticed the push for those two isn’t as strong, because PR is 50% Republican and Guam would be considered conservative by mainstream standards.
#599 Re: The Garden » Current Events Thread » 257 weeks ago
Lol ok ID
What glorified city?
The one codified into federal law - Washington DC. The one you need an amendment to change, and has zero chance being approved by SCOTUS.
#600 Re: The Garden » Current Events Thread » 257 weeks ago
Randall Flagg wrote:Axl S wrote:Every citizen have a right to vote and cost shouldn't be a barrier to that. What if someone's homeless - should they have a right to vote?
You're arguing to restrict voting access based on socioeconomic circumstance (which already is the case in some places).
Anyway, this problem is fixed with free federal issued ID.
Unlike the UK, the US has no National ID. And no, social security numbers don’t count. Nor is your SSN card required to register. The nation is trying to create “Real ID” standards for identification requirements in all 50 states since 9/11, but the process has already been delayed several years and was recently delayed until 2023. Some people in the US are adamantly against any form of federal ID, as evidenced by those opposed to e-verify. Only in America can you register to vote with a utility bill and nothing else.
Ironic to me that the same people who think Microsoft is planting chips in you are the same ones who want a federal database of IDs.
It seems clear you’re going to bypass any arguments about ‘if you’re going to create these rules you need to give easy access to those that might have some trouble obtaining them’ arguments by continuing to point out other countries have them.
It’s irrelevant.
I’ve never said anything about chips being implemented. Should I assume you think vaccines cause autism since a lot of left wing Berkeley types hold that view. I’m all for free ID, but that’s not an argument from anyone with authority legislating new laws. They want to ban ID, it’s in the law. No ID law not present at the date the law becomes signed can be implemented after it’s signed. That’s in the bill.
I haven’t ignored anything. It wasn’t part of the discussion. You’ve yet to explain why requiring ID is a burden and how in light of all the hacks and the absolute desire of Russia, China and any entity hostile to the US would love to harm our election system, we shouldn’t ensure adequate oversight and control.
Yes, we point to examples of success where it’s occurred. You and others have no problem doing so when you advocate for National healthcare or paid maternity leave. Why is this situation any different?
