Interesting. Why? Like under what standard? As a GNR album? As an album from a modern band? It's all about perspective to me. Like what makes you view it like that?

My position is this:

Musically: Successful. Love it.

Sales A : Compared to normal band successful, came in at #14 worldwide, enough to continue the band.

Sales B: Compared to GNR historical level of world domination  - very very poor.

Marketing: very poor. I think the music was good enough to attract some new fans, but the implimentation of this record was SO badly handled. The delays. The silence. The lack of promo. No interviews. No tour. Not playing the media games that can attract attention to the work.

Production: Some issues. Problems with the vinyl versions. Cd booklet bad. etc. Cover art not to everyone's taste. Mixing issues.

So IMO...there's been a lot of stuff that could have been handled better for sure, especially when you have a level of fame and stardom that a band like GNR/Axl does.

But fundementally I couldn't say it's been a failure, not when the've sold enough records for the band to continue, and not when the artistic product underneath remains at a very very high standard.

I think you are still a fan...but I think part of atari's original point stands:

It came up in the context of if most people who D/L songs on the net pay for them latter after trialing them.

I thought he was saying that while a lot of fans of the band on here downloaded the album, and then went and bought a paid copy, it's less likely that casual listeners and non-fans would do this.

Which isn't to say someone with a deep interest in GNR (like yourself) who doesn't buy the record isn't a fan. (Although TBH i do feel you should to support what you are interested in - but that's a seperate issue).

So what I mean is....some people who downloaded the album would have been people with less interest in GNR than a fan like you, and basicly were just checking it out, if there had been no leaks and no internet theft in general, then those "experment" type listeners may have purchased it to check it out.

Yeah...i've often thought the major thing that frustrates fans is the periods of silence where we don't undertsand what is happening in his world. It leads people to speculate and get angry and talk shit, and it seems axl then reads that shit and doesn't like it.

Obviously Axl can do whatever he likes, and is under no obligation to do stuff for us, but I sometimes wonder if he had some kind of online blog, or showed up at HTGTH once every month or two or something more regular, how much of the fan base would chill out.

Sort of how trent posts from time to time on stuff at NIN, sometimes its a rant, sometimes its stuff about the band, and sometimes its ramble...but at least you know he's alive, what's in his mind, and have some idea that stuff goes on that we can't understand but appriciate its going on.

Then again, it must be tough to live with the type of public crap axl often gets in the media and from fans. I'm not saying he's a saint, but I also think there's a % of people - like youtube posters and stuff - who just want to hang some shit. So maybe he just doesn't need anymore exposure to it.

But there only would have been one review if it hadn't leaked.  The reviews came from leaked material.

I think the album was sucessful in the sence that other bands sell less and continue to make albums, so i reject the idea that's been put forward by some that this band is dead due to the sales figures of CD. However, I also think that this album would have sold higher if it wasn't for the leaks, in particualr the last leak that was virtually everything.