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#851 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 461 weeks ago
They are just starting to put their toes in the lifeboats now...
#852 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 461 weeks ago
It's a lawyer tactic too...they try to get you to take a position that you did not intend because they know it's a losing position. Once you start defending the contrived position, you've lost.
This.
Ignore all the noise that people like Lyin' Randy kick around. It's meant to put everybody on the defensive (those who are asking questions/demanding answers are in charge-not the other way around) and muddy the waters. False comparisons, character attacks, word play, hoping from one foot to the next. Another tactic is this massive wall of text that includes a combo of all of these moves. I watched these psychos do this with Iraq, they'll lie all day long, point fingers, and eventually run away from any accountability once the dust settles. They'll do the same thing when this is all over too, just watch.
#853 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 461 weeks ago
Keep in mind, this is only the info the Press obtained, including Jrs email. How many other meetings, discussions, emails and all were there. And of them, how many do the FBI & CIA have?
Don Jrs a douche who was out there on TV claiming the Russia connection was completely untrue just weeks after this meeting. And the whole 'She didn't deliver anything' part in unknown as well. She may have clearly indicated they do have the hacked emails, might have put a price onto them we don't know. Kushners a douche too, how many meetings has this guy "forgotten" about.
I agree, Collusion, on its own isn't a crime I don't think. However I heard Conspiracy is. If there's a pattern of meetings & discussions about this, then it goes down that road. Also, gotta wonder "who" leaked this email to the press. And, how many others are there.
It also goes against the "fake news" narrative Trump and his gang constantly push. NYT was going to run with those emails, so Jr. released them first. Hardly fake.
Jr. lied about meetings. Jr. lied about the subject of the meetings, several times. Kushner didn't disclose them initially. Manafort and Kushner went along to get the "scoop", which sure sounds like conspiracy to me. For a group of people who aren't guilty, they sure seem to lie an awful lot about what they do. It might be different if it were one thing, but it's not. It's an enormous pile of things, including wanting to set up a back channel that excluded our government, using Russian infrastructure, and Trump pushing hard to re-open those Russian camps that Obama closed. On and on...there is a reason Brian William acts like he's got a huge scoop every night, because something insane comes to light almost every day with this group.
Also to your point, this is what we're getting from the media. I can only imagine what the Feds have which we don't know about.
The Ukraine "story" is not even remotely the same. I read the article, clearly Flagg did not. It's another series of "whataboutism" and false equivalency put up by the right. It's meant to distract and muddy the waters, which is what the GOP are pros at. They want everybody to talk about that, and not Trump. That's their game, and that's Flagg's MO 24/7.
#854 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 461 weeks ago
I'm just shocked he released these emails. They do him no favors. I'll give him credit for transparency, but it doesn't alleviate him from what he's entering into. This is getting really bad.
Turns out the NYT were going to release the emails, so he wanted to beat 'em to the punch.
From today (really read this):
"The June 3, 2016, email sent to Donald Trump Jr. could hardly have been more explicit: One of his father’s former Russian business partners had been contacted by a senior Russian government official and was offering to provide the Trump campaign with dirt on Hillary Clinton.
The documents “would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father,” read the email, written by a trusted intermediary, who added, “This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump.”
If the future president’s eldest son was surprised or disturbed by the provenance of the promised material — or the notion that it was part of a continuing effort by the Russian government to aid his father’s campaign — he gave no indication.
He replied within minutes: “If it’s what you say I love it especially later in the summer.”
Four days later, after a flurry of emails, the intermediary wrote back, proposing a meeting in New York on Thursday with a “Russian government attorney.”
Donald Trump Jr. agreed, adding that he would most likely bring along “Paul Manafort (campaign boss)” and “my brother-in-law,” Jared Kushner, now one of the president’s closest White House advisers."
#855 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 461 weeks ago
False equivalency, whataboutism, strawmen, lies and semantics.
You could give Conway a run for her money.
#856 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 461 weeks ago
You mean the part where he says "borderline" and caveats it with "if this story is true" meaning JR met with Russian spies.
1) We know the story is true. Dummy. We have email proof provided by Jr.
2) Wow, I never saw this coming. Facts mean nothing to you. When two legal experts -both lawyers with decades of experience-step up and say this is a crime, I tend to believe them. But that's not good enough for the arm chair legal expert Flagg, who can't admit somebody could possibly know more than he does. Perhaps you should give them a call and explain the law to them?
#857 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 461 weeks ago
Donald Jr. has admitted to this meeting. Made the emails public. At first he lied about meeting Russians. Then lied about WHY he met them. Finally said he went there with the sole purpose of colluding with them and then ended the meeting once they couldn't produce the goods. That's collusion. He admitted it. This is not a conspiracy. This is not hysteria. There is no more proof to demand.
Now it's up to Mueller.
#858 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 461 weeks ago
(Remember when SLC claimed Flynn was going to "flip on Trump", then a few weeks later said he never said any of this nor that Trump was ever under investigation).
.
What the hell are you talking about?
You misrepresent/lie about our positions, so much....that's the biggest issue here. Everybody takes issue with this.
#859 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 461 weeks ago
No, they didn't Can you link the article where W's ethics lawyers called it a crime?
"Boarders on Treason."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05cU89C7YB0
And Jill Wine-Banks...
'IT IS COLLUSION': Watergate special prosecutor draws the line after Trump Jr.'s email revelation
Former assistant Watergate special prosecutor Jill Wine-Banks drew a clear line on Donald Trump Jr.'s meeting with a Russian lawyer, after a bombshell New York Times report on Monday revealed that he was told in an email that the information he was receiving was part of a Russian strategy to assist then-candidate Donald Trump's presidential campaign.
"This is an astounding thing," said Wine-Banks on MSNBC. "It is collusion with a foreign adversary if they were working together to get the information from the Russian government."
The Times' report cited three officials familiar with the email that was sent by music publicist Rob Goldstone, who represented the son of a wealthy Azerbaijani-Russian developer and has ties to the Trump family. The Times' sources alleged Goldstone's email "indicates" that Russia was the source of the information, which was supposed to have been damaging to then-candidate Hillary Clinton's presidential campaign.
Wine-Banks also hinted that the latest revelation would be looked at by special counsel Robert Mueller, who was appointed by the Justice Department to oversee the investigation into allegations of Russian involvement during the 2016 US presidential election: "We have, for sure, more evidence for Mr. Mueller to look at and get the details of," said Banks.
"And that's what this looks like, it looks like clear proof of collusion," Wine-Banks said.
#860 Re: The Garden » US Politics Thread » 461 weeks ago
Randall Flagg wrote:This meeting occurred before the leaks. And nothing has been put out there that suggests Jr received anything or this woman had any connection to the hacks?
C'mon, it's called common sense. Secondly, give it a few more weeks, it'll come out. You keep yelling out "There's nothing there", then, when a couple weeks later some more news comes out about it, you say "Oh please, there's nothing else there". Then, a few more weeks later MORE news breaks, you say again "Oh please, there's nothing else there. Is that all you have?". Its a never ending cycle with you. I've said from the start it might take 1-2 years for all this to go down. It's not looking good right now, wouldn't surprise me if by New Years this whole things a huge mess.
This x 1000. ^^^
Why would anybody defend Trump to being with? It seems like such a losing proposition. Flagg hates liberals more than he likes Trump, so there is the issue. It's all he knows: argue with liberals. So even though he was against Trump, he must defend Trump, because...liberals. At some point though you must realize you're making an ass out of yourself. Right?
Right?
