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misterID
 Rep: 460 

Re: A Song Of Ice And Fire

misterID wrote:

I'll be reading the books again soon and I want to get into some theories. The biggest one for me atm is who wrote the pink letter. It had to be Mance. It had to be. The language used, the knowledge of everything, not to mention it brings up Mance being alive is basically: Hey, Jon, it's me, Mance!

I've watched some great theory vids on YouTube, and there's a great idea that Melisandra masterminded the whole thing. If that's true, the letter is what got Jon killed as it made his mind to abandon the Knights Watch. If it's true, was his death also in her plans?

Rocky
 Rep: -7 

Re: A Song Of Ice And Fire

Rocky wrote:

Mance seems to be the best candidate since he's one of the few that would have had all the information in the letter.  It could be someone on Mance's behalf, but then we're just splitting hairs.

I disagree with Mel being behind it.  Her visions showed Jon being surrounded by daggers, and she warned him that his life was in danger - he dismissed it.  Jon wanted to lead the Night's Watch into battle because he thought Arya was in Winterfell.  That is something orchestrated by Little Finger and the Lannister's with the Bolton's.  It wasn't anything Mel had any part in.  What is most interesting from Mel's visions and what makes me consider her "good" is that her visions show her Blood Raven as an agent of the Great Other and Bran as his pawn.  If Rh'llor is at odds with the Great Other (and he is), he wouldn't intenionally deceive her into thinking Blood Raven was an agent of the Great Other if his goals weren't in concert with him.  Granted, Rh'llor could be lying since BloodRaven's goals may not align with his own, but the text has made this battle about a Song of Ice and Fire, so any help would be wanted in this great war.

misterID
 Rep: 460 

Re: A Song Of Ice And Fire

misterID wrote:
Rocky wrote:

Mance seems to be the best candidate since he's one of the few that would have had all the information in the letter.  It could be someone on Mance's behalf, but then we're just splitting hairs.

I disagree with Mel being behind it.  Her visions showed Jon being surrounded by daggers, and she warned him that his life was in danger - he dismissed it.  Jon wanted to lead the Night's Watch into battle because he thought Arya was in Winterfell.  That is something orchestrated by Little Finger and the Lannister's with the Bolton's.  It wasn't anything Mel had any part in.  What is most interesting from Mel's visions and what makes me consider her "good" is that her visions show her Blood Raven as an agent of the Great Other and Bran as his pawn.  If Rh'llor is at odds with the Great Other (and he is), he wouldn't intenionally deceive her into thinking Blood Raven was an agent of the Great Other if his goals weren't in concert with him.  Granted, Rh'llor could be lying since BloodRaven's goals may not align with his own, but the text has made this battle about a Song of Ice and Fire, so any help would be wanted in this great war.

Good post.

Is she seeing Bloodraven as the great other? She asks if it's the great other as a question. But isn't the vision of Bran the answer to her asking to see the King? She's really not great at her interpretations as she's blinded by her belief in Stannis.

I would really like to know Mance's goal of brining Jon to Winterfell.

misterID
 Rep: 460 

Re: A Song Of Ice And Fire

misterID wrote:

Okay, after re-reading:

Val is million times more interesting than Dany. I mean, holy shit... I hope Jon ends up with her.

Mance is a bad ass. He and Jon are the two characters I'm most interested in.

I still don't get Littlefinger's convoluted goal.

Everyone in Hardhome is dead. Spending all that time in the ice cells about how they don't let any meat spoil was a pretty big hint with where we'll find Jon. If he warged into ghost, which is pretty clear he did, I don't think he'll come back as empty as the others who've been revived from death.

I'm strangely rooting for Stannis, though it seems he's going to burn.

I don't give a shit about anything happening in Bravos. Dany is the worst part of the story. Tyrion is stuck with another dwarf with a completely boring story. Everything in Bravos dies.

Neemo
 Rep: 481 

Re: A Song Of Ice And Fire

Neemo wrote:

I always thought LF was sowing discord and war while slowly amassing power and land so he could take a run at being king after everyyhing falls apart

Re: A Song Of Ice And Fire

AtariLegend wrote:
Neemo wrote:

I always thought LF was sowing discord and war while slowly amassing power and land so he could take a run at being king after everyyhing falls apart

Littlefinger had the Vale, the Key to the north, Sansa (thinking Rickon and Bran were dead), Harrenhal in the Riverlands and influence in King's Landing in various plots... he might also have something else up his sleeve via (Winds preview chapter). Keeping in mind that everyone up north is involved a war where they're running out off men and the Vale is untouched... he thinks he's in a good position.

He's obviously making a play, he did scheme to start the war in the first place and has everyone killing each other off.

Problem is, he doesn't know about what's happening beyond the wall and might not have factored in Danny's dragons to the equation.

The show writters didn't have any idea what to do with Littlefinger after they ditched George's direction (post pushing Lysa to her death).

misterID
 Rep: 460 

Re: A Song Of Ice And Fire

misterID wrote:

The show having LF give Sansa to Bolton was completely dumb. I guess I don't get the marriage plans for Sansa, etc.

I did hear a great theory that the reason Jaqen was in Kings Landing dungeon and on the way to the wall was that he was hired by LF to kill Ned. I'm not sure I believe that as Cersi said LF was the one to encourage Joffery to behead Ned. Why would he waste the money?

Does anyone think Lady Stoneheart will play any part with Jon? BWB seems to be planning something nasty at the Twins.

Rocky
 Rep: -7 

Re: A Song Of Ice And Fire

Rocky wrote:
misterID wrote:

The show having LF give Sansa to Bolton was completely dumb. I guess I don't get the marriage plans for Sansa, etc.

I did hear a great theory that the reason Jaqen was in Kings Landing dungeon and on the way to the wall was that he was hired by LF to kill Ned. I'm not sure I believe that as Cersi said LF was the one to encourage Joffery to behead Ned. Why would he waste the money?

Does anyone think Lady Stoneheart will play any part with Jon? BWB seems to be planning something nasty at the Twins.

Jon is already dead, so I don't know what role she'll play with him.  I question how much of LS is actually Catelyn versus some ghoul.  Berric said he lost a piece of him every time he died, and he was raised minutes after each death.  Catelyn had been floating for days when they found her.  I know magic and all that, but the amount of decay that would have on someone's brain cells is... alarming.  Her throat is still cut from the red wedding, so I just wonder how much of LS is actually Catelyn.  Martin posted a few years ago that neither Berric nor Catelyn are alive, and their bodies are slowly decaying.  If Jon is resurrected, with or without transferring his soul to Ghost, I think he has a limited future in Westeros.  It sure won't be the bitter sweet ending of the show where he rides off North finally a free man. 

I don't think Jaqen had anything to do with LF or Varys.  I think he was sent to recruit Arya on his mission to the Citadel to get the book on dragons.  That he was in the cells in the first place was his own ploy.  I know that action requires a level of clairvoyance, but glass candles and prophecy all make that some what possible with existing lore.  LF does have a connection to Bravos, but as you said previously, LF is out of his league and has no idea what the Others and Dany's dragons will bring.  His end won't be the abomination the show gave him, but I don't think his will be a happy one.

misterID
 Rep: 460 

Re: A Song Of Ice And Fire

misterID wrote:

G R.R. Martin when asked why he killed Jon Snow: "So you think he's dead, do you?"

There's a big group of people who don't think he's dead but gravely wounded. I think the blade to the gut and back aren't easy to come back from without magic. And we don't know if Jon will come back from a kiss, or some other way. Jon going off beyond the wall at the end as TKBTW makes a lot of sense to me.

LF plan was just so flimsy and depended on a lot of chance. Did he think he'd have a chance with Cat?

misterID
 Rep: 460 

Re: A Song Of Ice And Fire

misterID wrote:

I just realized the one-eared black cat that hangs around Kings Landing is Rhaegar's daughters kitten that Varys mentions in GOT.

Anyone have any theories about Patchface?

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