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wasted
 Rep: 2 

Re: UK General Election, 12th December 2019

wasted wrote:

Honestly after last few years, just Corbyn and he gives everyone free stuff. One last down hill run. Borrow, borrow, borrow. There is no way we are working our way out of this. Our best role is like charitable losers. Tea and toast, the BBC, gin, maybe some homebrew elderflower wine. Acid and rock bands playing in fields of cow shit.

Re: UK General Election, 12th December 2019

AtariLegend wrote:
wasted wrote:

Honestly after last few years, just Corbyn and he gives everyone free stuff. One last down hill run. Borrow, borrow, borrow. There is no way we are working our way out of this. Our best role is like charitable losers. Tea and toast, the BBC, gin, maybe some homebrew elderflower wine. Acid and rock bands playing in fields of cow shit.

According to some experts that don't write for tabloids, the Labour spending promises add up more than the conservatives' atm.

The torries are literally just making up numbers atm. There's a front cover of a paper today, claiming Labour would cost the country £1.2 Trillion and the leave the country in debt for decades.

For reference this is the same party that came to power in 2010 suggesting they'd pay it off by 2015. Just last year under May, the projections were that it wouldn't be paid off till mid 2060's despite all the glorious austerity.

Any argument attacking Labour's spending proposals is deeply flawed. Better switching off when someone mentions debt, it's just a line.

wasted
 Rep: 2 

Re: UK General Election, 12th December 2019

wasted wrote:
AtariLegend wrote:
wasted wrote:

Honestly after last few years, just Corbyn and he gives everyone free stuff. One last down hill run. Borrow, borrow, borrow. There is no way we are working our way out of this. Our best role is like charitable losers. Tea and toast, the BBC, gin, maybe some homebrew elderflower wine. Acid and rock bands playing in fields of cow shit.

According to some experts that don't write for tabloids, the Labour spending promises add up more than the conservatives' atm.

The torries are literally just making up numbers atm. There's a front cover of a paper today, claiming Labour would cost the country £1.2 Trillion and the leave the country in debt for decades.

For reference this is the same party that came to power in 2010 suggesting they'd pay it off by 2015. Just last year under May, the projections were that it wouldn't be paid off till mid 2060's despite all the glorious austerity.

Any argument attacking Labour's spending proposals is deeply flawed. Better switching off when someone mentions debt, it's just a line.

Like Blair in the 90s. Basically bankrupted “the country” but it was a party and probably the reason for Brexit.

There’s just no way not to borrow a ton so why not go crazy. It’s just whether you can or not, it might be the end of the country but if not, Labour are probably the best option if you aren’t really rich or just insanely poor to the point of being beyond help.

You probably will get something out of Labour bankrupting the country. It may not be the best thing long term but no one is thinking long term.

I wonder if we are already maxed out the credit cards and if there is Brexit if Labour can actually make that work. But it seems even after Brexit they will still be spending, they’ve just changed some of the deals and taken some control back and immigration won’t change much but there’s a feeling it’s back under control.

But overall if Labour are throwing money around none of these issues will be as such a big deal. Austerity kind of triggered all this anti EU stuff. And sure they are a bunch of corrupt suits and they don’t care that much about British people.

So to annoy them a little and then just go back to borrowing tons of money to live well because we have a military kind of seems like the move. The toffs wanted the power back, now Labour give everyone free stuff. There’s a balance there even though it makes no sense.

Re: UK General Election, 12th December 2019

AtariLegend wrote:

Blair did not bankrupt the country. The global recession happened while Brown was pm and it was hardly his sole fault.

National debt doubled under the Torries. Austerity failed.

wasted
 Rep: 2 

Re: UK General Election, 12th December 2019

wasted wrote:
AtariLegend wrote:

Blair did not bankrupt the country. The global recession happened while Brown was pm and it was hardly his sole fault.

National debt doubled under the Torries. Austerity failed.

Semantics. I speak very generally about these things. I would say that it’s bankrupt in terms of the person on the street’s understanding. I’m no political expert but I’m interested to see how my understanding fits into things.

That’s the irony, austerity was a way to borrow more. That’s all that we can do. It’s delaying the inevitable or something that never happens. Like the US will never pay back what they owe. UK should ignore the debt. Wipe it, not have the people pay for it. It’s all about cooking the books so the world doesn’t descend into chaos.

But we find ways (borrowing) to service the debt. So it becomes almost an abstract thing. Countries like Greece, Italy and Spain have all teetered on the edge. The deal for UK was always immigration for almost unlimited borrowing. If we leave the EU there’s less easy borrowing but maybe there’s other ways. Broader international deals. It’s a risk. For the rich there is no real risk it’s all a power game.


But this is the impression I got from the 90s in the UK. Everything was going well, there were benefits flying everywhere. The credit ran out, it seemed. And the solution was for the people to pay for it, austerity. The fall out played out under Brown and then Cameron came in to convince everyone it was time to shape up. But as I remember he borrowed a ton as part of the austerity deal.

Cutting benefits I think gave people a reason to look for a scapegoat, immigration and EU were blamed by a certain group and they wouldn't Vote Cameron unless he offered them a referendum first.

The final point is that although we say we run ourselves. That’s our big thing, through democracy and rights the people have their way. There’s a sort of intimacy between constituencies and the people. We are repped by the MPs. But what seems to happen is that it’s more of a power grab by the rich elites, even on labour’s side, the money is really funneled away from the people and the economy. Candidates like Boris or Blair have a charm that seems to make it look well meaning but really it’s about agreeing to be taxed and that money fuels the rich. It’s never benefiting people. If it was we wouldn't be in debt. Everyone is working, where does all the money go?

Boris or Trump are seen as these idiots but they work as distractions from what is happening. They soften the blow of the stick. You’re asked to be a big man nd take huge risks with low interest rate borrowing to set up businesses, pay for your own health care, education etc.

Corbyn or Blair will seem like they care about people. And for me they work better for the people, until the bill comes up. As in if this is a fake game, why not take some hand outs, because the economy of the country is not taking off in any miraculous way.

Re: UK General Election, 12th December 2019

AtariLegend wrote:

I think i'd vote for a united ireland now. I have had enough of the Tories.

wasted
 Rep: 2 

Re: UK General Election, 12th December 2019

wasted wrote:
AtariLegend wrote:

I think i'd vote for a united ireland now. I have had enough of the Tories.

It’s all a bit of a shambles.

I read a headline in The Sun, Corbyn to tax cars 60%? Really going to turn people off.

Re: UK General Election, 12th December 2019

AtariLegend wrote:
wasted wrote:
AtariLegend wrote:

I think i'd vote for a united ireland now. I have had enough of the Tories.

It’s all a bit of a shambles.

I read a headline in The Sun, Corbyn to tax cars 60%? Really going to turn people off.

Also claimed he was a spy for the Czech Republic during the cold war.

The tabloids are beyond farcial.

wasted
 Rep: 2 

Re: UK General Election, 12th December 2019

wasted wrote:
AtariLegend wrote:
wasted wrote:
AtariLegend wrote:

I think i'd vote for a united ireland now. I have had enough of the Tories.

It’s all a bit of a shambles.

I read a headline in The Sun, Corbyn to tax cars 60%? Really going to turn people off.

Also claimed he was a spy for the Czech Republic during the cold war.

The tabloids are beyond farcial.

That’s why I check them out. You know nothing in the corporate media is true anyway but you see how far they will go in the tabloids. Also football coverage is good.

How would you see Brexit and a Labour gov working out. Supposedly the actual Brexit deal isn’t that much different than not leaving. Even immigration won’t change. As we know lorries are coming in with new people everyday. As soon as you hit the UK you have rights. And borrowing won’t be curbed that much. So are Labour more grounded in reality than Boris thinking we are going to dominate the world again? I see UK becoming more like Japan, more isolated internationally but still a solid country. I think under Tories it’s going to become even more like the US.

Re: UK General Election, 12th December 2019

AtariLegend wrote:

The polls next weekend matter alot. If Labour are in the mid 30's then there's a chance to force a hung parliment again.

However the turn out for generation z and y'ers is expected to be down dramatically this time. They need to turn out.

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