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#4371 Re: The Garden » 9/11 » 911 weeks ago
Here is my challenge to you. Provide me with evidence of any chemical residue of an explosion.
#4372 Re: The Garden » 9/11 » 911 weeks ago
See, that's the thing. Those pictures prove absolutely nothing. Where's the plane? Where's the bodies, the luggage, the wings, the engines? How come this plane was able to fly a few feet above the ground at 500 mph without touching the lawn? Where's all the videos of the plane hitting the pentagon? If that little piece of "plane" made it unscorched that far from the building, how did everything else vaporise? Where's the damage from where the tail & wings that would've hit the building? There's cameras like every 30 feet on top of the pentagon, surely they picked up something. There's a highway camera facing exactly where the plane crossed over to hit the pentagon, where's that at? Basically, the burden of proof is on the government, yet they refuse to just show the footage. Why? And that's only the beginning of the Pentagon questions that should be easy to answer, but cannot be.
The burden of proof is not on the government, though they've already provided the proof. All the answers to your questions can be answered here: http://www.popularmechanics.com/technol … ht77debris
I certainly see damage to the surrounding area, although I don't expect there to be damage just because an object moving at high speeds flew over top. By that logic, there would be destruction to the area if a missle struck because a missle surely moves in excess of 500 mph.
#4373 Re: The Garden » 9/11 » 911 weeks ago
Sorry dude. Those videos don't fly. You're using a janitor as someone qualifed to state it was a bomb simply because he was rattled after the attack. The impact of those planes would have resonated and shook the entire foundation. I doubt anyone could pinpoint where it came from initially.
If a bomb exploded on ground level, why weren't people dead on the ground level? There would have been significant more damage had an explosion gone off.
The smoke at lower levels is fully and logically explained by the NIST.
"As stated in Section 6.14.4 of NIST NCSTAR 1, the falling mass of the building compressed the air ahead of it'”much like the action of a piston'”forcing smoke and debris out the windows as the stories below failed sequentially.
These puffs were observed at many locations as the towers collapsed. In all cases, they had the appearance of jets of gas being pushed from the building through windows or between columns on the mechanical floors. Such jets are expected since the air inside the building is compressed as the tower falls and must flow somewhere as the pressure builds. It is significant that similar 'puffs' were observed numerous times on the fire floors in both towers prior to their collapses, perhaps due to falling walls or portions of a floor. Puffs from WTC 1 were even observed when WTC 2 was struck by the aircraft. These observations confirm that even minor overpressures were transmitted through the towers and forced smoke and debris from the building."
http://wtc.nist.gov/pubs/factsheets/faqs_8_2006.htm
#4374 Re: The Garden » 9/11 » 911 weeks ago
I'm not playing an internet tough guy. I'm with the majority so I have no reason to play tough. Although your "dare" is laughable.
Maybe these will do.
#4375 Re: Guns N' Roses » Stolen Motorcyle (myspace bulletin) » 912 weeks ago
I'm glad to see everyone pointing out the obvious and not trying to defend GNR. Over a year of silence and we get a fucking message about a fucking motorcycle. As if all of the 400,000 myspace friends are gonna start looking for some fucking bike. With every waking moment this band becomes more and more of a joke. With VR dying and Axl becoming more and more of a fucking cartoon everyday, I fear that the music we all love is coming to an end.
#4376 Re: The Garden » House approves $70 billion more for war » 912 weeks ago
The Iraq war has so far cost each American 3000$ in inflation. Would people have condoned the war if they knew/understood this?
Absolutely not. The american people were conned into supporting this war. Bush used the emotions of 9/11 to prep this country for war with Iraq. It worked. It was supposed to be a cake walk, and even Bush himself basically declared "mission accomplished" right after it started. In reality, the dipshits had no idea how to handle the situation and the "mission" had just begun.
After thousands of lives lost and burying us in debt, we're still no closer to winning than we were when we walked in there. Hell, McCain wants to be there for 100 years. I say give him a one way ticket there and don't let him leave. That 100 years wish will turn into an immediate pullout wish awfully damn quick.
I'm still waiting to see all those Iraq chemical weapons that could kill the world five times. They haven't even found a trace of that shit.
The Iraq war is gonna go down as the biggest foreign policy blunder in world history.
I couldn't disagree more James. We didn't invade Iraq until 18 months after 9/11. The emotional state of the country can't be blamed. No one was conned into this war. All the intel that exist today was available then. There were plenty of people against the war for the very same reasons that came to fruition. While intel certainly did support that probablility of WMDs in Iraq, there was faults in the intel that unfortunately were ignored. That being said, the months of warnings and deliberation certainly afforded Sadam the oppurtunity to relocate those weapons to Syria. Every component of a WMD was found in Iraq as well. I'm not saying they existed, simply that the whole idea of being duped and total lack of cause is wrong.
If people emotionally supported an attack on another nation without doing the slightest bit of research, then they're more wrong than the people who led the charge. Congress authorized and continues to support this war. No amount of spin is going to change that.
I was against the war from day one because I couldn't give a damn about an Iraqi life and they posed no threat to the US. Now that we're there, I fully support staying until that region is secure and every last combatant is killed. (PS, I'm actually on Active Duty so I'm not a rightwing chicken hawk). If we do anything less than that, the region will collapse and become worse than we ever imagined. This will force us to return to a much more dangerous and organzied warzone that will result in many more deaths. I care only about American lives and will do whatever it takes to minimalize our loss, both present and future.
#4377 Re: The Garden » Naomi Wolf, 10 steps towards fascism. » 912 weeks ago
Not a single one of those have happened. Not to mention the entire list is arbitray. Coincidental that she chose 10 things eh? The only one that has an ounce of reality to it, is number 9. However, that is not applied by the government but by individual citizens. Frankly I believe that many of the "anti-war" advocates are treasonus in their behavior. Not all or even the majority, but a select few who see this as an oppurtunty to act on their disillusionment.
Anyway, this is almost a year old and has been posted in some way or shape in the community several times. It's extrene paranoia and leftist bullshit and that's why it hasn't gotten any attention by the real media. I can goto inforwars.com on a daily basis to read that garbage.
P.S.: This isn't a direct attack against you Polluxlm. You and I agree on several issues and you didn't even right this article, you just posted it. So while I'm sure you care, please don't take my response as an attack on you.
#4378 Re: The Garden » 9/11 » 912 weeks ago
mitchejw wrote:The Cleveland stuff is pretty messed up.
Also, I was wondering if any of you could help me out with this. I always wondered why these giant buildings in New York landed so neatly on top of themselves. I don't understand how such a reckless thing like a plane crash would cause such neatly falling buildings.
What do you think?
I think 'controlled demolition'.
The laws of physic does not permit the official scenario to happen. There's just not enough force to make a massive steel core collapse in on itself. Not to mention all the anomalies; Smoke coming from the base of the buildings and witnesses saying they heard explosions in the basement, steel columns blasted hundreds of meters away from the building, WTC7 collapsing, BBC news report saying the building had collapsed 30 mins before it did (#7), molten steel at the site, traces of termite etc.
Whether you believe it to be a conspiracy or not, the official story simply does not hold water.
None of that means a damn thing. Show me proof of smoke coming from the bottom of the tower, not some supposed eye witness who was traumatized from the event. Secondly, why would smoke come from the bottom if an explosion took place as you claim? Smoke only comes from fires or the aftermath of an explosion. Physicist have proven time and time again that the "official" story is entirely feasible. Just becuase you found a few who distort the events and claim it didn't doesn't make it impossible. You choose to believe a few witnesses who think they heard something in lieu of the thousands who didn't. I'm sorry, but none of these "witnesses" were qualified or in the right state of mind to judge what happened.
Point and case with your argument on cell phones on the plane. Someone who is so certain of foul play would hopefully at least know that air phones are on every other seat on most airlines if not every seat. You're using two clocks as a defense for your argument? Are you kidding me. Two clocks that aren't linked to a central computer happen to be 5 minutes slow. You do understand that clocks lose time and the custodial staff probably has more pressing issues than making sure the thousands of clocks in that building are in synch. Did it ever occur to you that those clocks could have been a personal clock in a cubicle and the person didn't care to keep it accurate. Let's try an experiment Polluxlm. Ask 10 different people the time when you're out and about and I bet you get several different answers.
OH NO! The BBC reported a building fell before it did. That must mean it was planned! Or, as happens thousands of times, they reported an error. I don't have the time line in front of me, but didn't they make a decision at some point not to save building 7? Was that decsion made more than 30 minutes prior to its collapse. Would it be logical for someone to say that Building 7 was gone based simply on the fact there was no effort to save it. Furthermore, with 2 buildings already fallen, could someone have just jumped the gun and made an assumption?
Everything you list is circumstancial. I honestly feel sad for people who buy into this because they are either socially inept or fucking retarded cause an educated or intelligent person wouldn't buy into this bullshit. For all the "experts" on the Truthers side, there's thousands more on the side of reality. You don't need a government conspiracy to add to your case that Bush is a fuckup. You can make that aargument without visiting fantasia and Ron L Hubbard.
I'm sure some of you will "smite" me for this because I called you out and asking for actual proof. I really couldn't give a damn. When I see people posting bullshit that wouldn't pass for a high school report and claiming the mythical Illumanati, I have to ask for the check. Having an intelligent conversation about this issue is apparently impossible here because most of you are incapable of an intelligent discussion and there's really not anything to discuss about 9/11.
3,000 people died because 19 angry, muslim men hijacked 4 planes and flew 3 of them into 3 different buildings. No hollograms, no missles, no drones. Thousands of people have died in relation to those attacks, a majority of which is fighting for their country. I'll be damned if I'll let anyone dishonor their service and death by spreading hate and lies such as what is written here without at least a response.
#4379 Re: The Garden » House approves $70 billion more for war » 912 weeks ago
My point is only those who have a vested interest should have that kind of responsibility. I'm not saying they should vote a certain way; how they vote is entirely on them. But someone who doesn't pay taxes or contribute to the economy shouldn't have the same say as a forty year old with a wife and two kids.
People only focus on what is important to and affects thems. Unfortunately, what affects the working class is what is most important to the country and the world. Teenagers worried about lowering the drinking age and elderly scared of change aren't what's good for America. It is because of the lack of involvement that our country is on a downward spiral. This is the downside of a Democracy as polluxlm stated.
Would you prefer a dictator who only does things from his point of view? Cause unless we enact measures that force people to vote responsibly, things are only going to get worse.
#4380 Re: The Garden » Prisoners to be chipped like dogs » 912 weeks ago
This is obviously a huge privacy violation, but criminals lose their rights when they are convicted. With capital punishment being taboo in most of the world, it is more cost effective to truly install the fear of big brother into those that won't benefit being behind bars for life.
I generally don't like slipper slop arguments because, well it's a logical fallacy. If people were vigilant, we could have programs such as these without running the risk of it being forced on every citizen.