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Re: All Original GUNS Members Will Be At ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME
His contributions were nothing great?
Ummmm.... All drums n AFD, remember that? What suddenly the drums are just adequate on AFD because why? You're trying to build up Matt or because you don't like what you percive as others overrating Steven so you'll exagerate to diminish what he actually contributed? yeah the drumming on the greatest rock n 'roll album ever in my opinion merely fits and theres no way that guy could've carried on and recorded Illusions. Yeah right. Being a FAMOUS drummer isn't a be all end all criteria for being a good drummer. Had Steven not been in Gn'R he'd never have been a famous drummer? .... yeah and I guess the rest of the guys were destined for super stardom with or without Guns N' Roses? Ummmm.... fact is they were all in Gn'R and that is why they all got famous.
I like Matt as well and I think he should be in the Hall. NOT once have I ever talked bad about Matt or knocked his ability. I think what he did on the Illusions is GREAT just as what Steven did on AFD is GREAT so this revisionist's history where people start saying Steven was great for AFD but there's no way he'd have been able to carry the torch had he not been kicked out over addictions it's just a bunch of nonsense to justify Matt and it's unnecessary. Steven never went on to do anything of relevance due to his addictions.
Again, more over reacting, more being dramatic. You jumped into an argument with me when I WAS TALKING about people demeaning Matt to build up Steven, for whatever reason. I'm not a fan of Matt. But I think they're both deserving of going into the HOF. That was the argument. I never diminished his contributions on AFD, the only thing I said was that nether he or Matt wrote a song for the band, which put them in the same boat about contributing in writing music.
Yes, Steven's drumming is average on AFD. Nothing special. He doesn't have to be anything great on AFD. His drumming fit the album perfectly. I can't imagine another drummer on the album. He played on a great album, but that does not make him great. But his and Matt's contributions were perfect for the albums they played on.
Not an exaggeration and I'm not diminshing what he did on AFD. You guys are making that up. I think what Steven did on AFD was really cool, but it did not make him a great drummer.
And his addictions causing him to not do anything else; Gar Samuelson was in the same position and actually died after only releasing 2 albums with Megadeth, but everyone in the rock and metal community considers him a great drummer.
Re: All Original GUNS Members Will Be At ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME
faldor wrote:. But to say that Yesterdays, or some other UYI track is better than There Was A Time, or some other CD track JUST because the latter are more well known doesn't really prove anything more than they're just more popular.
Just my honest opinion but TWAT is the most overrated Guns song ever by Guns N' Roses fans. Yesterdays in my opinion blows TWAT outta the water. To be honest the only songs off the Illusions that I'd say TWAT is better than is My World and Get in the Ring and maybe Bad Apples. TWAT is not even close to the best song n CD in y opinion. Obviously my opinion is shared by..... well likely nobody else on these Gn'R forums but my guess is the pubic opinion would check out of that song as well. I don't know that song is just so "try hard" , so drawn out and boring to me.
I'm with you on TWAT. I don't dig it. Even with the Bucket solo, something rubs me the wrong way.
I think I like Sorry best off CD, but I'm not sure anymore.
Re: All Original GUNS Members Will Be At ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME
misterID wrote:The list is your list. I'd put TWAT, Better and Prostitute in the top ten if I'd rank them. I think CD is a great album, don't need anyone to share that opinion. You have your own taste, I have mine. Doesn't mean anyone is more right than the other. The old vs new thing is getting real old.
I never bought the whole music is subjective thing..
If u asked 100 people top ten GNR songs of all time.. their list would look similar to that.
If u put those 3... what 3 are u taking out?
people used to try to pull that with me about Finck and Slash. I would tell people u can't say Finck is better than Slash and they'd pull all this my opinion bullshit.
something can be your "Favorite" but that doesn't make it better.
Emancipation is my all time fave Prince album... I'd be crazy to say its better than Purple rain or Sign o the times or 1999.. its my fave but i can be objective enough to know that on NO planet would Emancipation be considered his best album:
Dirk Nowitzki is my Favorite NBA basketball player of all time. I like him MORE than Michael Jordan but I'd never say he is "Better" than MJ. Why? cause there are tangible arguments u can point at and prove why MJ is better and I can do the same as to why Slash is better than Finck.
Same with my top 10 list of GNR songs.
U can have your ten favorites.. but if u are being objective u couldn't possibly penetrate that list with CD stuff.
The ten I listed aren't my 10 fave GNR songs but when u take everything into account, personal feelings aside, those would be in 99 percent of peoples' definitive list.
Your problem is that whenever anyone gives any credit to the new line up, or CD you have a temper tantrum and can't handle it. You have to make a new vs old argument out of everything. If not you wouldn't have to go out of your way to try and convince people that Buckethead's TWAT solo isn't anything special. I sure don't see you pulling this shit over at HTGTH.
And if you took a poll with 100 people and TWAT was ranked number one that would make it the best GN'R song ever? Not only is that stupid logic, but you'd also say it doesn't count because they don't "get it."
YOUR LIST IS YOUR OPINION. NOT FACT. PERIOD.
Obviously if we're using your logic, Slash is either not a great guitar player, or he's 64th. Which poll are we going by? Only the ones that rank him #1?? Or in the top ten?? Which is it? Which 100 peoples opinion's count?
Re: All Original GUNS Members Will Be At ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME
Agree with bono on twat. Lyrics are terrible. Has. Good solo and outro Axl vocal. Bout it. That being said,its a good song but nowhere close to coma nr, estranged epic level. Its on par with breakdown dead horse etc which isn't bad company
- monkeychow
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Re: All Original GUNS Members Will Be At ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME
always knew on some deep level you guys didn't like the twat 
Nah but seriously I am kinda surprised how others don't dig it as much as me. It's one of my favourite songs overall.
I agree with it being on par with a "breakdown" generally - but that high vocal outtro puts it on another level to me - must be one of the hardest things to sing Axl's ever recorded.
I will say I think it gets stronger from the bridge onwards. But my (controversial) opinion on why that is, is that the guitar part during the verses (bucket I think) really distracts and doesn't fit the song (IMO).
Don't mean to be shitting on bucket cos he does a great outro solo - but the combination of the loops at the start - then the sort of strange guitar over the first verse - sounds like someone who had no idea what to put in that spot and just played random background notes but then it's volumed up to be a lead line. Odd.
Anyone remember the leak version without that stuff - I think people call it a 1999 leak but I have no idea if that is true. It was basicly the same song - except with a really nice synth line during the first and second verse and ending after the robin solo. Missed the bucket solo...but I'd love to hear that version except with the bucket ending...the changes to the start were unnecessary to me.
But that's my armchair analysis....overall love the song...one of my absolute favourites.
Re: All Original GUNS Members Will Be At ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME
Agree with bono on twat. Lyrics are terrible. Has. Good solo and outro Axl vocal. Bout it. That being said,its a good song but nowhere close to coma nr, estranged epic level. Its on par with breakdown dead horse etc which isn't bad company
I like the lyrics but agree it's on par with Breakdown...still a great tune but can't put it with November Rain, Estranged, Coma, Locomotive, and Civil War. 
Re: All Original GUNS Members Will Be At ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME
always knew on some deep level you guys didn't like the twat
Nah but seriously I am kinda surprised how others don't dig it as much as me. It's one of my favourite songs overall.
I agree with it being on par with a "breakdown" generally - but that high vocal outtro puts it on another level to me - must be one of the hardest things to sing Axl's ever recorded.
I will say I think it gets stronger from the bridge onwards. But my (controversial) opinion on why that is, is that the guitar part during the verses (bucket I think) really distracts and doesn't fit the song (IMO).
Don't mean to be shitting on bucket cos he does a great outro solo - but the combination of the loops at the start - then the sort of strange guitar over the first verse - sounds like someone who had no idea what to put in that spot and just played random background notes but then it's volumed up to be a lead line. Odd.
Anyone remember the leak version without that stuff - I think people call it a 1999 leak but I have no idea if that is true. It was basicly the same song - except with a really nice synth line during the first and second verse and ending after the robin solo. Missed the bucket solo...but I'd love to hear that version except with the bucket ending...the changes to the start were unnecessary to me.
But that's my armchair analysis....overall love the song...one of my absolute favourites.
I think during the chats when asked about his guitar playing Axl said he wrote the chorus for twat.
I know what you mean about it sounding out of place, in the first leak I thought it sounded much worse, really tuneless strumming. Then the MSL leak came out and it had that new heavier sound in the chorus, I thought it was a big improvement, but even then its still pretty dull.
*edit no I didnt know what you meant, I do now, I'm talking about something different lol. Fuck me, time for bed 
Re: All Original GUNS Members Will Be At ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME
Oh I said all that on HTGTH about how the guitars were subpar
U ever heard of the delete button we get hit with?
Trust me, I should have 1000 more posts.
So u think TWAT is better than November Rain,Sweet Child O mine and Jungle?
There are also people who think Dumb And Dumber is a better movie than Pulp Fiction....
