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ClaudeF
 Rep: 6 

Re: Timeline of the recording sessions for the new leaks

ClaudeF wrote:

UPDATED 3:39 Eastern...this is everything visually confirmed but not heard so far. Will update again if I'm able.

Inspired by the work of Zombux, who documented the band's recording sessions, I started a timeline of when these new leaks were recorded.

2000

March

23
“Me & My Elvis” 5:40
“D Tune” 5:16
“Curly Shuffle” 3:43
“Oklahoma” 4:12

27
“State of Grace” 4:00
“I.R.S.” 4:14
“Atlas Shrugged” (25) 4:12
“Perhaps” (19) 3:56
“Prostitute” (23) 6:10
:Catcher” (30) 5:35

October

5
“Dub Suplex” (Dat #5) 3:02
“Devious Bastard” 3:26
“Dummy” 6:24

12
“T.W.A.T. (#10) 5:10

15
“Billionaire” (Dat #2) 1:31

23 “The Blues” (#6) 4:44

November

5
“Madagascar” (Drum adds) 5:37
“Chinese Democracy” (Version 1) 3:12

7
“Circus Maximus” 4:30
“As It Began” (Version 1) 3:51
“Riad” (Version 1) 3:33
“Silkworms” (Version 1) 3:33

8
“Nothing” (Version 1) 3:50
“Thyme” (P.R.L.) 1:55
“Hardschool” 3:58


2001

April

3

“Inside Out”
“3 Dollar Pyramid”
“Tommy Demo #1”
“Tommy Demo #2”

June

27

“Madagascar”:
Drums up (Version Tom Likes)
Drums up Instrumental
Drums down 3 dB
Drums down 3 dB Instrumental
Old Josh Drums
Original Brain Drums

“Chinese Democracy:
Old Josh Drums
New Brain Drums

“The Blues”:
Old Josh Drums
New Brain Drums

“Rhiad”:
Old Josh Drums
New Brain Drums


July

2

Rough Mixes of New Brain Drum Takes:
With vocals
Instrumental

13

New Brain Drum Takes:
Vocal at Regular Level
Vocal Down 1 dB
Instrumental

19

New Brain Drum Remixes with Axl:
“Rhiad”
“Rhiad” (Ed’d Toms)
“Prostitute”
“The Blues”

August

20

New Brain Drums:
Drums at Regular Level
Drums up 1.5 dB
Drums down 1.5 dB

27

Brain Drums Remix with Snare Sample from “Silkworms”:
Ambience Down, Mono Room Off
Ambience Down with Mono Room
Ambience at Original Level
Snare Sample during Outro Only
First Half with Old Snares, Second Half with Snare Sample Only

September

6

New Brain Drum Takes (3rd Time):
Drums and Guitars at Regular Level
Drums up 1 dB
Drums up 2 dB
Guitars up 2.5 dB, Drums at Regular Level
Guitars up 1 dB
Guitars up 0.7 dB
Instrumental with Drums and Guitar at Regular Level

November

13
Straight Analog Downloads (These Are Not Final)

“Prom Violence”:
Take 2
Take 3

“Three Dollar Pyramid”:
Take 2
Take 4

Undated:

“The Blues” (New Brain Drum Takes):
Vocal at Regular Level
Vocal Down 1 Db
Instrumental

zombux
 Rep: 33 

Re: Timeline of the recording sessions for the new leaks

zombux wrote:

good! I haven't updated my sheet yet, will probably do it tomorrow.
the "undated" section is probably error, it's the Blues CD from 2001-07-13

ClaudeF
 Rep: 6 

Re: Timeline of the recording sessions for the new leaks

ClaudeF wrote:

The adjustments of levels is not unique - I've got other promo CDs (for other bands) that show the same kinds of fine-tuning. U2 even released a CD to radio stations with the recording sped up in one version and slowed down in another.

sp1at
 Rep: 29 

Re: Timeline of the recording sessions for the new leaks

sp1at wrote:
ClaudeF wrote:

UPDATED 3:39 Eastern...this is everything visually confirmed but not heard so far. Will update again if I'm able.

Inspired by the work of Zombux, who documented the band's recording sessions, I started a timeline of when these new leaks were recorded.

2000

March

23
“Me & My Elvis” 5:40
“D Tune” 5:16
“Curly Shuffle” 3:43
“Oklahoma” 4:12

27
“State of Grace” 4:00
“I.R.S.” 4:14
“Atlas Shrugged” (25) 4:12
“Perhaps” (19) 3:56
“Prostitute” (23) 6:10
:Catcher” (30) 5:35

October

5
“Dub Suplex” (Dat #5) 3:02
“Devious Bastard” 3:26
“Dummy” 6:24

12
“T.W.A.T. (#10) 5:10

15
“Billionaire” (Dat #2) 1:31

23 “The Blues” (#6) 4:44

November

5
“Madagascar” (Drum adds) 5:37
“Chinese Democracy” (Version 1) 3:12

7
“Circus Maximus” 4:30
“As It Began” (Version 1) 3:51
“Riad” (Version 1) 3:33
“Silkworms” (Version 1) 3:33

8
“Nothing” (Version 1) 3:50
“Thyme” (P.R.L.) 1:55
“Hardschool” 3:58


2001

April

3

“Inside Out”
“3 Dollar Pyramid”
“Tommy Demo #1”
“Tommy Demo #2”

June

27

“Madagascar”:
Drums up (Version Tom Likes)
Drums up Instrumental
Drums down 3 dB
Drums down 3 dB Instrumental
Old Josh Drums
Original Brain Drums

“Chinese Democracy:
Old Josh Drums
New Brain Drums

“The Blues”:
Old Josh Drums
New Brain Drums

“Rhiad”:
Old Josh Drums
New Brain Drums


July

2

Rough Mixes of New Brain Drum Takes:
With vocals
Instrumental

13

New Brain Drum Takes:
Vocal at Regular Level
Vocal Down 1 dB
Instrumental

19

New Brain Drum Remixes with Axl:
“Rhiad”
“Rhiad” (Ed’d Toms)
“Prostitute”
“The Blues”

August

20

New Brain Drums:
Drums at Regular Level
Drums up 1.5 dB
Drums down 1.5 dB

27

Brain Drums Remix with Snare Sample from “Silkworms”:
Ambience Down, Mono Room Off
Ambience Down with Mono Room
Ambience at Original Level
Snare Sample during Outro Only
First Half with Old Snares, Second Half with Snare Sample Only

September

6

New Brain Drum Takes (3rd Time):
Drums and Guitars at Regular Level
Drums up 1 dB
Drums up 2 dB
Guitars up 2.5 dB, Drums at Regular Level
Guitars up 1 dB
Guitars up 0.7 dB
Instrumental with Drums and Guitar at Regular Level

November

13
Straight Analog Downloads (These Are Not Final)

“Prom Violence”:
Take 2
Take 3

“Three Dollar Pyramid”:
Take 2
Take 4

Undated:

“The Blues” (New Brain Drum Takes):
Vocal at Regular Level
Vocal Down 1 Db
Instrumental

Thanks smile It'll be interesting comparing what is known and written historically, to the recordings

Voodoochild
 Rep: 3 

Re: Timeline of the recording sessions for the new leaks

Voodoochild wrote:

Thanks, good stuff there. I could swear I had seen some track(s) dated 1998 in those pictures.

Also worth noting: even though the dates are for the mixing and bouncing of the tracks, there's probably some actual recording sessions with the addition of Brain drums and Bucket guitar work.

zombux
 Rep: 33 

Re: Timeline of the recording sessions for the new leaks

zombux wrote:
Voodoochild wrote:

Thanks, good stuff there. I could swear I had seen some track(s) dated 1998 in those pictures.

Also worth noting: even though the dates are for the mixing and bouncing of the tracks, there's probably some actual recording sessions with the addition of Brain drums and Bucket guitar work.

exactly. I guess it was all happening in multiple "branches" - they used old stuff (pre-2000, including the Beavan album) and were re-mixing it, at the same time they were re-recording some parts, at the same time they were recording new stuff... I imagine that it all was happening in parallel and stuff was thrown in the mix all the time during the process.
that means two things - 1) it's simple to tell the (let's say) rough mix date - we usually have that one noted right on the CD. but it's almost impossible to tell when all the parts of the mix were actually recorded.
anyway. do we exactly know when Josh left and Brain joined?

Chinese Whispers say:
Last show of the [Primus] Australian leg was on 04/29/00. Brain would therefore audition for Guns in around May.

and news about Josh out of the band date to March.

that means one simple thing - the Rough Mixes #1-#4 are marked either from early 2000 or late 2000. they all are spread randomly around all 4 discs (we don't yet have the exact info from #2 but we can guess it's the same as the rest). at least the early 2000 stuff therefore can't have Brain on drums - as simple as that. we know that after Josh left, they auditioned some other drummers but didn't like any of them, so we can quite safely rule anyone else than Josh out - that means Josh is drumming on 100% of the early 2000 stuff (even though he was already out of the band).
we haven't heard the late 2000 stuff yet (still talking about the late 2000 MIXES! not recordings) - so there might be either Josh or Brain on drums. I'd say that it's Josh everywhere, but we still need to wait for the actual music, to hear if the late 2000 mixes sound the same as the early 2000 mixes and therefore it would be Josh everywhere.
the rest of the stuff is clearly either Brain (notes like New Brain Drums tell us that thing for sure), or it includes versions with both drummers to compare - and at that point we can know which of the drummers is there so we know roughly when the DRUM track was recorded. one could say that we would also be able to guess the recording times of the rest of the songs - but that might actually be not that easy. the rest of the songs might be recorded at any time by any lineup, and even if both songs will differ only in the drum track, we still won't be able to tell if the rest of songs was recorded in "Josh time" or later. the only way to tell would be only if the very same track would be included on the Rough Mix #1-4 discs.
huh. I think I overcomplicated it a bit, right?

sp1at
 Rep: 29 

Re: Timeline of the recording sessions for the new leaks

sp1at wrote:

Josh said when he left there was 20ish songs with vocals and 20ish without. Brain said he re-recorded 30ish tracks. In 2006, there were 30, low 30s amount of tracks with vocals, and other without, from talks with Merck. We can throw in Ides of March as an instrumental from the 2000s, and we know other tracks were added later that sourced from other members. It also looks as though Prom Violence and 3 Dollar Pyramid were tracks with extra work. Just thinking out loud

sp1at
 Rep: 29 

Re: Timeline of the recording sessions for the new leaks

sp1at wrote:

State of Grace could be about the movie. SCOM was on the soundtrack, and it is highly regarded by people in music

Voodoochild
 Rep: 3 

Re: Timeline of the recording sessions for the new leaks

Voodoochild wrote:
zombux wrote:

and news about Josh out of the band date to March.

that means one simple thing

LOL, not simple at all. 16

I guess you are correct. Just some other considerations:

Are we sure Axl wanted Brain to rerecord everything Josh did? I mean, we still got Brain and Frank together (sometimes in the same song) in the final album. Or maybe Brain rerecorded just the songs that Axl and RTB considered as A-List?

-Brain Drums Remix with Snare Sample from “Silkworms”:

The way it's written, it doesn't sound like the song itself is Silkworms. The Snare Sample trick could be used to put together a new drum track in a grid (it's basically a way to apply reverb to separated drum parts). There's a great YouTube channel explaining how Andy Wallace (who mixed the Antiquiet leaks and even had some of his work in the final album) uses that Snare Sample thing:

sp1at
 Rep: 29 

Re: Timeline of the recording sessions for the new leaks

sp1at wrote:

"What surprised me is that they supposedly had Brain re-do my drums note for note." (Josh Freese, Podocast, 04/13)

"Josh Freese was the drummer before and he had basically played drums on about 30 songs and when he had left Axl really liked my 'feel', so he was like 'Well, I really liked what Josh played, but I want your 'feel'." (Brain, EQTV, 10/08)

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