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A Private Eye

 Rep: 77 

Re: The Sopranos

A Private Eye wrote:

Not watched in a little while bit I remember thinking the final couple of seasons felt a bit dialled in.

Interesting reading the theories above on 'that' final scene, don't think I ever offered an opinion at the time.

Hidden Text:

I think Tony dies, for me it's clear and that final black shot is from Tony's pov. Doesn't someone even say to him earlier in the season when talking about being shot dead that you probably don't even hear the shot.

As for all the focus on Meadow I think it's as much practicality as symbolism. Think back to the seating plan and assuming Tony is shot by the guy who goes to the toilet, if Meadow is sat in the vacant seat then she's right in the firing line and the guy no longer has a clean shot. By being late the guy has a clear shot at Tony from the doorway. I'm sure there's some symbolism wrapped up in that but imo the main focus on Meadow being late is that if she had been on time the hit on Tony probably couldn't have happened. Not cleanly anyway.

polluxlm

 Rep: 221 

Re: The Sopranos

polluxlm wrote:

Hidden Text:

I think Tony dies, for me it's clear and that final black shot is from Tony's pov. Doesn't someone even say to him earlier in the season when talking about being shot dead that you probably don't even hear the shot.

As for all the focus on Meadow I think it's as much practicality as symbolism. Think back to the seating plan and assuming Tony is shot by the guy who goes to the toilet, if Meadow is sat in the vacant seat then she's right in the firing line and the guy no longer has a clean shot. By being late the guy has a clear shot at Tony from the doorway. I'm sure there's some symbolism wrapped up in that but imo the main focus on Meadow being late is that if she had been on time the hit on Tony probably couldn't have happened. Not cleanly anyway.

Hidden Text:

There is a forum called Chase Lounge where they really go to town with the analysis of this scene, and others. In short they think he was killed too. The Meadow connection goes back to the beginning of season 6 when she is the one who calls him back from the dead. The symbolism then is that since she didn't show up to save Tony, he is dead. Which of course also works practically with the line of sight.

Me I'm leaning towards neither death nor life. If he was killed, by who? They stress the point that Butchie wants peace when he talks with Phil earlier, so I don't see it likely it would just be a ploy. If NY doesn't kill him there aren't really any viable candidates. Another thing is the planning. How do they know he is at Holstens? Sure, they could have followed somebody, but with the botched hit on Tony (couldn't find him) and the less than stellar hit on Silvio and Patsy, it doesn't seem likely NY would be savvy enough to track down Tony to Holstens. And why not just kill him at the meeting in the first place? The symbolism may strongly suggest that he is killed, by I don't see the in-Universe logic for it.

And those two contradictions is what makes me think he isn't alive either. That's not the point of the scene. The fade to black is imo just a device to say the show is over, but without definite closure. He could be dead, he could be alive. It is open ended to please both camps. If you want to think he lives on you can, if you want to think he got his just deserts you can. And I think that is why Chase refuses to answer the question. It's a question he is not supposed to answer since that would ruin the entire point, ambiguity.

I like it. If Tony lives in a happily ever after scene some people would say it's unrealistic, a cop out. If he dies you will have many fans who don't like that either. Instead you get an ending people still talk about years later. In a way the show still lives on since we can never be sure about the outcome. And that is fitting for a show many people would have liked to go on forever.

James

 Rep: 664 

Re: The Sopranos

James wrote:

Hidden Text:

If he's really dead and Chase wants us to believe its a sanctioned mob hit he should have brought the other NY families into the series. Tony's family is almost gone and Phil has just suffered a decapitation strike. Who sanctioned the hit on Tony?

I think you're right. Its meant to go both ways.

Neemo

 Rep: 485 

Re: The Sopranos

Neemo wrote:

Started watching this series finally...i watched it on and off for the last 2 seasons...but never from the beginning

PaSnow

 Rep: 205 

Re: The Sopranos

PaSnow wrote:

In hindsight I think the ending was a copout altogether. One could argue Seinfeld ended kinda lame, but Soprano's was neither here nor there. Sure "it keeps you guessing".... for infinity.

I recall Cheers had a great ending, and The Wonder Years. Married With Children stayed 2 or 3 seasons too long, I sorta forget how it ended but it was no longer at its peak like most others.

monkeychow

 Rep: 661 

Re: The Sopranos

monkeychow wrote:

I love sopranos.

However was chatting with a mate the other day and we were saying it was better before it started with Flashbacks and dream sequences and things of that nature. It kinda got a bit much.

Amazing acting in the show though and so entertaining.

James

 Rep: 664 

Re: The Sopranos

James wrote:

In hindsight I think the ending was a copout altogether. One could argue Seinfeld ended kinda lame, but Soprano's was neither here nor there. Sure "it keeps you guessing".... for infinity.

Its even worse the more distance we get from it.

I guarantee if Chase could go back he would give it an actual ending. Once Gandolfini died and there was no going back, it just leaves it in limbo.

Chase has flip flopped on that ending and IMO this shows he hoped to come back to it either for one more season or a movie.

I also think it was a huge mistake not to have Tony endure a trial of some sort. The story practically begs for it. Unfortunately for fans of the series, it simply became a huge paycheck for all involved and became more about that and not telling an incredible story worthy of those characters. The last two seasons are brutal with just a few good episoded mingled in with the crap. It became way too self indulgent with those dream sequences and it was a sign to just wrap it up.

johndivney

Re: The Sopranos

johndivney wrote:

BULLSHIT

Ending was ding he settled on where least amount of people would be annoyed& "getit" whatever "it" was. Conclusion non conclusion brings nascent lifeblood to proceedings: hell for ducks sake we're still talkin about it 10 years after it happened, 40years after Dallas.

It's more a novella where the story picks up half way thru and ends before the final,act of characters life.
I'm cool,with that. Best show ever.
Final few seasons with divorce &'aj 's suffering are stellar.

jimmythegent

 Rep: 30 

Re: The Sopranos

jimmythegent wrote:

Greatest show of all time hands down, and IMO never declined in quality.

The ending was perfect - I can't for the life of me understand how a fan who'd watched the entire series would want to be spoonfed the ending - people seem to be disappointed that they didn't actually see a shot of Tony with his brains blown out? There are so many clues and metaphors over the whole last series as to what was coming and the final scene plays it perfectly - as David Chase has repeatedly said "its all there" - you've just got to be watching closely.

I agree with the poster who said the fact people are still talking about the last scene 10 years later means it did it's job to a tee.
The one show I can watch over and over and never tire of. Pure art

Randall Flagg

 Rep: 139 

Re: The Sopranos

Randall Flagg wrote:

I didn't watch the series until I was in Iraq and bought a pirated Haji copy.  I thought they fucked me on the ending.  Great series.  I generally like the ending.