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Re: Duff Joining GNR (Oct 14, 2010) was awesome but dumb
If there was a reunion (or just a show) I'm sure it would be made up of several current GNR members.
...eh, the more I think about it, I just don't see Axl ditching Tommy, Chris, Ron or even, at this point, DJ - seeing their relationship seems to be pretty strong. I guess I just don't see a reunion happening period. Which makes me think if there was any kind of reunion it would be a one off show, maybe just a couple of songs if Axl and Slash ever bury the hatchet. But seriously, even if they did talk again, it doesn't mean they'd play together. Axl seems very comfortable right now with his level of control and how he goes about his shit, despite what anyone thinks. I don't think he'll change no matter what the situation, or who was in the band or any amount of money on the table.
See, the moment I start even considering the possibily of a reunion, reality jumps up and squashes it.
And even the one-off doesn't work, because it creates a business issue for Axl outside of those shows. How does he push the new band most of the year, and a reunion on certain parts.
The only way one-offs work is down the line when Axl is completely done outside of performing the hits, gets the old guys together for 'x' amount of shows per year, and they just go around as a nostalgia act. But even that has a set amount of time in it. Even if they all pulled in their solo material and CD, they still don't have a Stones or AC/DC catalog to fall back on.
misterID wrote:See, the moment I start even considering the possibily of a reunion, reality jumps up and squashes it.
Yeah. The personal stuff can be patched up, but the business aspect of it is irretrievably broken. Slash/Duff/Izzy won't rejoin GN'R unless they are given the same level of control they had in the Appetite days. Why in the hell would Axl give up his 100% control for a reunion? His only incentive is money, which isn't an issue for him. The main incentive could be credibility in the music world and the possibility of a great album with the old members? Maybe, but I don't think he gives a crap at this point.
The only way a full-blown reunion will happen is if Slash/Duff/Izzy are willing to be Axl's employees. Fat fucking chance of that ever happening. This all goes back to their rather idiotic decision to sign over their rights to the name so long ago. Who gives a crap if he threatened to quit? Don't give up what you helped create. If they had kept their rights, he would quit and eventually a reunion would happen after a revolving door of singers. But by giving him 100% control, there's no way he's going to budge on the "partnership vs. employee" issue. Maybe the drugs hurt their decision-making process at the time. Or maybe they were just naive. Or it was probably a combination of the two.
The shitty thing for the fans is Axl got the huge recording contract for Chinese Democracy thanks to the GN'R brand, but what did he do with it? He dicked around for almost 15 years after the band officially broke up. I have a feeling if the guys hadn't signed their rights over to him that they would have done some pretty good stuff during that 15 year period under the GN'R name with the big label contract. And eventually the fans would get to see Axl come back for a reunion.
The only way it works and potentially lasts on a regular level is if the old guys become contract players like Axl wants, and the old band and new band are merged, and that becomes Guns N' Roses. Axl retains his control, the old members get a certain share probably not as high as Axl's, but not as low as the newer guys, and the newer guys get an even bigger cut of what they get now, and Axl STILL holds all the cards in the end. Because if the old guys suddenly get sick of it, Axl's still got people in his phonebook, and the old guys can be replaced in 48 hours - goodbye.
That's the only way it happens. And i'm fine with that frankly. They're all in it for the money and pussy anyways. (for the music, yeah, when they were 16 maybe 
)
As for what the old band would've done through the rest of the 90's AS GN'R, I think you over-value it. Only Izzy seemed to be churning out quality material on his own. Slash & Duff's solo stuff both needed some more time in the oven to cook, and Axl just plum didn't work, so I highly doubt any of them would've gotten anything done together. They MIGHT have squeezed out another studio album before the end of the decade, but it would've probably had the same storied history that CD did.
- tejastech08
- Rep: 194
Re: Duff Joining GNR (Oct 14, 2010) was awesome but dumb
As for what the old band would've done through the rest of the 90's AS GN'R, I think you over-value it. Only Izzy seemed to be churning out quality material on his own. Slash & Duff's solo stuff both needed some more time in the oven to cook, and Axl just plum didn't work, so I highly doubt any of them would've gotten anything done together. They MIGHT have squeezed out another studio album before the end of the decade, but it would've probably had the same storied history that CD did.
That's why the big label money is a key aspect IMHO. So if Axl quit, they could replace him with a hot shot who has plenty of creativity to bring to the table.
Re: Duff Joining GNR (Oct 14, 2010) was awesome but dumb
In the last 20 years, have the old guys ONCE even came close to replacing Axl?
Weiland was the best they could do and they didn't even get past security.
Don't under-value Axl. He gave them their uniqueness in alot of ways. Too bad he seemed pissed off that people liked him.
- tejastech08
- Rep: 194
Re: Duff Joining GNR (Oct 14, 2010) was awesome but dumb
In the last 20 years, have the old guys ONCE even came close to replacing Axl?
Weiland was the best they could do and they didn't even get past security.
Don't under-value Axl. He gave them their uniqueness in alot of ways. Too bad he seemed pissed off that people liked him.
I don't undervalue Axl. He's probably my favorite part of the original band. I'm just looking at what he did with the name (nothing) for 12 years when the other dudes probably would have put out some material. No way in hell it would have been on the level of AFD/Lies/UYI, but perhaps on the level of Contraband. I'd be fine with that. At least it would be something, and at least it would give us a reasonable path to a reunion. Right now there isn't a reasonable path because one guy holds all the cards. It's disappointing that the others were so foolish with such an important business decision because the fans may never get what we want. In the case of something like Van Halen, the singer was run off and came back for a reunion but the idea is you don't collectively hand over your entire group's control to one member under any circumstance. I just don't think the other guys will be willing to work as contract employees for something they created in the first place. That shit is just embarrassing.
Re: Duff Joining GNR (Oct 14, 2010) was awesome but dumb
It would be badass to see them reunite in almost any form, under almost any circumstances. But being brought back as contract players definitely would lessen the excitement a bit, as it does for any band. Van Halen's multiple reunions are a perfect example. Booting out Michael Anthony and bringing back DLR as an employee just sours things- they're not a "band" anymore- it lessens the tightness and camaraderie. In the end, it HAS to severely limit creativity as well. Who's going to put they're best and most interesting stuff out there, when in the end all the decisions, blame or credit is going to go to one or two people?
But like I said, I'd take it if that's all that was offered for GNR. As others have said, though, I'm more interested in whatever incarnation can put out new music and be truly active. The current lineup is SO ready to fill that role- they're the best shot we have at new (and ideally, REGULAR) output. I hope to God it doesn't fizzle away.
- tejastech08
- Rep: 194
Re: Duff Joining GNR (Oct 14, 2010) was awesome but dumb
If i'm looking at a stage with Axl Rose, Slash, Izzy Stradlin, Duff McKagen, Steven Adler, Dizzy Reed.... I ain't gonna give a damn how it happened.
It's gonna kick all kinds of major ass.
Just the way I feel
It won't happen like that though. Slash's ego is too big, and rightfully so IMHO. He's a fucking Guitar God. He shouldn't need to answer to anyone as his boss, especially not when it comes to material he helped create in the first place.
Re: Duff Joining GNR (Oct 14, 2010) was awesome but dumb
Well, you can look at it this way. If the band members demand large salaries and don't feel like taking the financial risk of a potential riot or Axl meltdown, then they may not have an issue in a contractual employee relationship. Ego or not, in the end, it will be about the money. Fans likely won't be privy to the financial details anyway.
Re: Duff Joining GNR (Oct 14, 2010) was awesome but dumb
That might be plausible for just a reunion tour of the old hits. I don't see them agreeing to anything like that if they want to record new stuff with him though. The waiting and inevitable Axl delays over new material would drive all of them insane especially Slash. And they would have no recourse since he owns the name.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Duff Joining GNR (Oct 14, 2010) was awesome but dumb
Best thing would be to put in a clause that if the new album isn't released within 18 months of the end of the instrumentals then ownership of the recordings reverts to the band and they can finish it as they wish. Tipping Axl wouldn't go for that though.
